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sai tyrus
09-09-2011, 01:53 AM
I have a Geforce GTX 270 I believe. Debating whether to upgrade to a 570 or try dual 480s. Recommendations? I'm thinking dual 480s would be too much heat and take up too much space in the case.

Thanks!

sai tyrus
09-09-2011, 01:56 AM
Correction: was thinking of getting the Geforce 560c reviewed here and running duals. Really leaning towards the single 570 though. I'll post system specs later...

Suicidal ShiZuru
09-09-2011, 02:02 AM
SLI 480s would of course create a ton of heat and take up space as well as drawing more power. Is your PSU good enough to handle it? Also they're rather hard to find right now. Do you plan on overclocking? For the price you could just go with a 580. What is your budget? Links to specific cards would help as well.

I'm in a similar position right now trying to decide on a card(s).

Whatevah
09-09-2011, 03:03 AM
I can vouch for the single 570. I have the EVGA GTX 570 HD and it is amazing. Handles The Witcher 2 at 1920x1080, with most settings on high (or ultra, the point is it looks amazing). I haven't run into a game yet that I can't max out and get 60 FPS. I haven't had to overclock to get this perfromance. It runs cool. The card doesn't go past 70 degrees celcius When I built my system I looked at dual 4XXs, but I'm glad I went with the GTX 570.
If you have $500 to spend on a GPU, yeah, go with the 580, but on a reasonable budget the 570 is an excellent card

Suicidal ShiZuru
09-09-2011, 03:31 AM
I can vouch for the single 570. I have the EVGA GTX 570 HD and it is amazing. Handles The Witcher 2 at 1920x1080, with most settings on high (or ultra, the point is it looks amazing). I haven't run into a game yet that I can't max out and get 60 FPS.


What kind of cpu are you running? Whole specs if you don't mind. I think I've decided to go with the EVGA GTX 570 2560mb and overclocking it. My build is for longevity so I'm going with a P67 mobo and figure I can just SLI the 570s if needed and then maybe get a 6xx series down the road. I'm a long time fan of Asus cards so I'm a little hesitant.

If you have $500 to spend on a GPU, yeah, go with the 580, but on a reasonable budget the 570 is an excellent card



SLI 480s tend to beat a stock 570 from what I've seen which is why I would suggest a 580 since the price is close.

sai tyrus
09-09-2011, 05:38 AM
My system Specs

Memory: OCZ Gold 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Low Voltage Desktop Memory Model OCZ3G1600LV6GK (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227365)

CD ROM: SAMSUNG Black 22X DVD Burner Black SATA Model SH-S223B - OEM (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151187)

Hard Drive: Western Digital Caviar Blue WD5000AAKS 500GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136073)

Tower: RAIDMAX SAGITTA 2 ATX-928WB Black 0.7mm SECC Steel ATX Mid Tower Removable MB Computer Case (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811156090)

Mother Board: DFI LANPARTY JR X58-T3H6 LGA 1366 Intel X58 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813136066)

Processor: Intel Core i7-920 Bloomfield 2.66GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor BX80601920 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115202)

Power Supply: OCZ GameXStream OCZ850GXSSLI ATX12V v2.2 and EPS12V 850Watts Power Supply (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341003)

Video Card: EVGA 896-P3-1170-AR GeForce GTX 275 896MB 448-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130475)

This (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130593) is what I was considering.

sai tyrus
09-09-2011, 05:40 AM
Don't plan on overclocking. Also hoping for longevity, though my build is now three years old. Also plan to max out the RAM at some point too. Total n00b in this area though, hence the questions! :D

Syl
09-09-2011, 06:20 AM
I'd go for a 560ti, 570 or ATI 6870 or 6950 if you want to go higher end.

Make sure you measure the amount of space you have for a new videocard. There's a chance that a newer, larger card simply won't have space inside of that case.

I would also NEVER suggest SLI or Crossfire anything unless it happens to be two of the top performing current cards on the market. SLI or Crossfire of older cards is an absolute waste of power and it never scales up perfectly.

Whatevah
09-09-2011, 06:53 AM
What kind of cpu are you running? Whole specs if you don't mind. I think I've decided to go with the EVGA GTX 570 2560mb and overclocking it. My build is for longevity so I'm going with a P67 mobo and figure I can just SLI the 570s if needed and then maybe get a 6xx series down the road. I'm a long time fan of Asus cards so I'm a little hesitant.

I don't know how to do the cool links, sorry
CPU: i5 2500k, it's overclocked to 4.2 ( I had to throttle down because my SSD was acting up and I read overclocking can cause that)
Ram: G. Skill 4 gb ripjaw at 1600 mhz
MOBO: Asus p8p67
GPU: EVGA GTX 570 HD I just went to newegg and got a card with a good price/egg rating ratio. The 570 is probably a little over kill, can't wait to try BF3 with it.
PSU: Corsair 750
HDD 1: OCZ Vertex 3 120 gb
HDD2: 1tb WD




SLI 480s tend to beat a stock 570 from what I've seen which is why I would suggest a 580 since the price is close.
If a 580 is in the budget, go crazy man. When I put my system together (first time builder) the 570 was as much as I could rationalize to spend on a GPU. I get 60 FPS on The Witcher 2, with V Sync on, SSAO, vignette, and Uber sampling off. I downloaded the DX11 patch and High res textures for Crysis 2, and at 1920x1080on the highest settings. I was clearing 30 FPS

The card doesn't usually hit past 70 degress C (when I did a little over clocking it hit 80, so I cut that shit out)

Orphiuchus
09-09-2011, 07:01 AM
A 6950 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161368) and a 6970 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131391) are exactly the same hardware, so you can grab a 6950 2gb and flash (http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/vidcard/159) it to a 6970, acquiring a card costing $350 for only $260.

Still the best deal in video cards.

Whatevah
09-09-2011, 07:03 AM
...but nVidia says it's the way it's meant to be played...I don't want to play it in a way other than intended...:rolleyes:

HB_IKE
09-09-2011, 08:57 AM
I'm currently happy with my 6870 2GB ... my bottle neck now is the HDD ... got a WD black caviar, might need a SSD if I get to impatient with the loading screens.

Anenome
09-09-2011, 12:02 PM
I have the 6970 and it's rockin. The Nvidia equivalent is also very good (570). If you really have money to spend, get the top of the line Nvidia card, the 580 which is better than the ATI equivalent (6990) (and also far quieter) and is actually two cards on one chip, automatic SLI.

sai tyrus
09-09-2011, 12:19 PM
Does it matter that te GTX 570 has GDDR5 memory rather than 3? Basically will my rig be able to run that even though the memory is for the video card and not the PC?

Syl
09-09-2011, 12:24 PM
Videocard memory is part of the actual videocard. It has absolutely nothing to do with what memory your motherboard uses.

GDDR5 is pretty much the reason that videocards are so fucking awesome at everything they do, if you go for anything less then it's not worth it.

I personally would go for an aftermarket cooled 6950 myself, I require multiple monitors and I find that ATI has better multi-monitor support these days with eyefinity.

Anenome
09-09-2011, 12:25 PM
Does it matter that te GTX 570 has GDDR5 memory rather than 3? Basically will my rig be able to run that even though the memory is for the video card and not the PC?
Naw, it's all internal to the card and won't affect your system at all. Don't worry.

sai tyrus
09-09-2011, 12:33 PM
Thanks. I thought so, but details can get you in the ass!

Suicidal ShiZuru
09-09-2011, 12:42 PM
GDDR5 has higher bandwidth therefore a higher bottleneck, is basically twice as fast, is better with altered voltages and consumes less power.

Ravijn
09-09-2011, 01:09 PM
You'd be very happy with a GTX 570. Shop around and see what you can do price wise. I'm not a Nvidia fanboy or anything. I've used both brands in the past and I've had much better luck with Nvidia over the years.

Let us know what you get!

Ravijn
09-09-2011, 01:11 PM
On another note...

On current PCs now what...if any...bottlenecks are there anymore? Seems all the components are up to speed so to say. I'm surprised they haven't made a new PCI Express slot yet. Could they go faster than 16x?

Orphiuchus
09-09-2011, 01:19 PM
On another note...

On current PCs now what...if any...bottlenecks are there anymore? Seems all the components are up to speed so to say. I'm surprised they haven't made a new PCI Express slot yet. Could they go faster than 16x?

Honestly, a 1000 PC today will max out everything to the point where worrying about performance is only for people who love the numbers.

If I don't see slowdown with everything turned up all the way I just don't worry about it.

I'm sure that something is currently a bottleneck, maybe storage HDs, but until a new generation of dx11 games starts to come out there isn't any point to worrying about it.

sai tyrus
09-09-2011, 01:21 PM
A 6950 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161368) and a 6970 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131391) are exactly the same hardware, so you can grab a 6950 2gb and flash (http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/vidcard/159) it to a 6970, acquiring a card costing $350 for only $260.

Still the best deal in video cards.

Does it matter that my video interface is PCI express 2.0x16, where the card you mentioned is PCI express 2.1x16?

Anenome
09-09-2011, 01:37 PM
Actually the biggest difference between ATI and Nvidia now is a question of whether you want multiple-monitor support or not. If you do, then your choice is already made: ATI for eyefinity support.

Orphiuchus
09-09-2011, 01:38 PM
Does it matter that my video interface is PCI express 2.0x16, where the card you mentioned is PCI express 2.1x16?

Well, from what I understand that multiplier refers to bandwidth, and no card is even close to using up the 1.1x16 bandwidth yet, so you're fine either way. All PCI-e revisions are backwards compatible, so it would only be a bottle-necking issue, and 2.0 and 2.1 are the same speed anyway. 2.1 features some PCI-e 3.0 features apparently, but I'm pretty sure its irrelevant.


Via Wikipedia:

PCI-e Capacity

Per lane (each direction):

v1.x: 250 MB/s (2.5 GT/s)
v2.x: 500 MB/s (5 GT/s)
v3.0: 1 GB/s (8 GT/s)

16 lane slot (each direction):

v1.x: 4 GB/s (40 GT/s)
v2.x: 8 GB/s (80 GT/s)
v3.0: 16 GB/s (128 GT/s)

Ravijn
09-09-2011, 01:45 PM
Honestly, a 1000 PC today will max out everything to the point where worrying about performance is only for people who love the numbers.

If I don't see slowdown with everything turned up all the way I just don't worry about it.

I'm sure that something is currently a bottleneck, maybe storage HDs, but until a new generation of dx11 games starts to come out there isn't any point to worrying about it.

That's what I figured. I'm still running an Intel q9550 with a GTX 470 and I never have any problems cranking up the game visuals and getting great frame rates. The only option in a game recently I couldn't enable was that 'ubersampling' or whatever it was called from Witcher 2. The game was playable but not as smooth with it off.

VenomUSMC
09-09-2011, 01:49 PM
What no more 3DMark epeens?
DAMN IT TO HELL

sai tyrus
09-09-2011, 02:07 PM
Actually the biggest difference between ATI and Nvidia now is a question of whether you want multiple-monitor support or not. If you do, then your choice is already made: ATI for eyefinity support.

Right now I'm a single-monitor guy. Mayhap next rig I'll get crazy. My step-son was asking me if I was going to build a computer after watching BF3's Caspian Border gameplay. lol.

Whatevah
09-09-2011, 02:14 PM
The gtx 570 is the best card ever and AMD blows nVidia 4 life!!!

But seriously, you can't go wrong with either this or 6970. It's a great time for hardware.

Whatevah
09-09-2011, 03:23 PM
Honestly, a 1000 PC today will max out everything to the point where worrying about performance is only for people who love the numbers.

If I don't see slowdown with everything turned up all the way I just don't worry about it.

I'm sure that something is currently a bottleneck, maybe storage HDs, but until a new generation of dx11 games starts to come out there isn't any point to worrying about it.

This is very correct. I spent about $1500 but I needed a monitor and win 7. I also spent much more on my case then I needed to.

VenomUSMC
09-09-2011, 03:33 PM
Id get a 6950 and flash it to a 6970 to save $

Anenome
09-09-2011, 04:05 PM
Id get a 6950 and flash it to a 6970 to save $
I was gonna do that, but you're not guaranteed to get a good one.

Orphiuchus
09-09-2011, 04:11 PM
I was gonna do that, but you're not guaranteed to get a good one.

I can only speak to my own attempt, naturally, but flashing worked like a charm for me.

Also note, 6950s have a "dual bios" feature, making recovery from an unsuccessful flash practical.

Anenome
09-09-2011, 08:37 PM
I can only speak to my own attempt, naturally, but flashing worked like a charm for me.

Also note, 6950s have a "dual bios" feature, making recovery from an unsuccessful flash practical.
Yeah, it's quite nice like that. I just didn't want to mess with it :P My buddy helping me build the rig wanted to do that tho.

Syl
09-09-2011, 08:57 PM
The main bottlenecks currently are Hard Drives, even SSD's hit bottlenecks.

Otherwise it's probably mostly videocard related at really high resolutions.

Suicidal ShiZuru
09-10-2011, 04:57 AM
Guess I'll just post here. What do you all think of this build?




ASUS P8P67 DELUXE (REV 3.0)

Corsair Professional Series HX1050 1050W

i7-2600K Sandy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W

EVGA GeForce GTX 570 HD Video Card - 2560MB, GDDR5, PCI-Express 2.0 (x16), Dual DVI, HDMI, DisplayPort, DirectX 11

G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 2133 (PC3 17000)

Corsair Force Series GT 2.5" 120GB SATA III SSD

Seagate Barracuda XT 2TB 7200 RPM SATA 6.0Gb 64mb cache

Corsair H80 cpu cooler

Anenome
09-10-2011, 10:53 AM
I seriously doubt you need a power supply that big...

Orphiuchus
09-10-2011, 11:04 AM
I'm not aware of any good reason to use a i7 2600k over an i5 2500k, particularly if you're going to overclock. I got a deal on my i7 from an intel employee, otherwise I would have gone with the i5.

Also, the 570 will perform nicely, but you can get roughly the same performance for like $70 less by using the 6950 flashing trick mentioned earlier in the thread.

Suicidal ShiZuru
09-10-2011, 01:43 PM
I seriously doubt you need a power supply that big...

Yeah it is overkill but I like having the extra room. I may go for an 850 instead.


I'm not aware of any good reason to use a i7 2600k over an i5 2500k, particularly if you're going to overclock. I got a deal on my i7 from an intel employee, otherwise I would have gone with the i5.

Also, the 570 will perform nicely, but you can get roughly the same performance for like $70 less by using the 6950 flashing trick mentioned earlier in the thread.

The price difference is not that much for an all around better processor. I went back and forth on this for a while and just said screw it. I do some editing so it will be beneficial in some way.

Orphiuchus
09-10-2011, 02:41 PM
...
The price difference is not that much for an all around better processor. I went back and forth on this for a while and just said screw it. I do some editing so it will be beneficial in some way.

Yea, all those extra threads might count for something in applications like that. I still say the 6950-6970 flashing is too good a deal to pass up. It puts crossfire 6970s around $460, which is amazing.

sai tyrus
09-11-2011, 05:09 AM
Another question...

So my power supply is here (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341003).

And I'm thinking about this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130593) card.

Under "system requirements" found under the Details tab, it says the following:

"550-watt power supply with a minimum of 38 amps on the +12 volt rail"

What the hell is the bit about the rail? I'm assuming I meet the requirement based on my power source. Do I look for a specific output on the power source that says 12 volts? Anyhoo, just wondering.

My current video card specs can be found here (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130475). I figure it's as simple as swapping it out, but I wanted to make sure with people who know what the hell they're doing. lol. Thanks!

Orphiuchus
09-11-2011, 08:18 AM
Another question...

So my power supply is here (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341003).

And I'm thinking about this (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130593) card.

Under "system requirements" found under the Details tab, it says the following:

"550-watt power supply with a minimum of 38 amps on the +12 volt rail"

What the hell is the bit about the rail? I'm assuming I meet the requirement based on my power source. Do I look for a specific output on the power source that says 12 volts? Anyhoo, just wondering.

My current video card specs can be found here (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130475). I figure it's as simple as swapping it out, but I wanted to make sure with people who know what the hell they're doing. lol. Thanks!

As long as you have a modern power supply you're good. You aren't going to have to worry too much about those specifics unless you do SLI or Crossfire. You can look at the PSU itself to see that information listed in most cases, and some PSUs have a little chart printed right on the side with all of that.

And you are good on swapping those video cards, just make sure you get rid of all of the old drivers before you remove the old one.

Anenome
09-11-2011, 10:43 AM
Sai, that power supply says it has 4 x 12v rails (see 'details' page). A "rail" means a dedicated power line coming out of the box to w/e you need to power. One of these you'll need to plug right into the top of the graphics card. It's super easy. If you were running SLI (2 cards) you'd need two rails. You have four, so you're fine.

Also, invest in some plastic pull-ties so you can arrange and secure all the cords in your system as you build it.

sai tyrus
09-11-2011, 03:08 PM
Thanks guys. Yeah, I saw what you mentioned Anenome, just wanted to make sure I was looking at it correctly/not being a dumbass. lol.

Agnostic Pope
09-13-2011, 12:22 AM
Guess I'll just post here. What do you all think of this build?




ASUS P8P67 DELUXE (REV 3.0)

Corsair Professional Series HX1050 1050W

i7-2600K Sandy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W

EVGA GeForce GTX 570 HD Video Card - 2560MB, GDDR5, PCI-Express 2.0 (x16), Dual DVI, HDMI, DisplayPort, DirectX 11

G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 2133 (PC3 17000)

Corsair Force Series GT 2.5" 120GB SATA III SSD

Seagate Barracuda XT 2TB 7200 RPM SATA 6.0Gb 64mb cache

Corsair H80 cpu cooler
I may jack (some) of your build in the near future and by near future I mean December. What OS are you gonna use?
Just 8 gigs?

Anenome
09-13-2011, 12:39 AM
In retrospect, I'd go 16 gig. But I'm a power-user. I hate being memory constrained.

sai tyrus
09-13-2011, 04:29 AM
Two more questions:

1. When installing a new video card, do I delete the old drivers before removing the old card? Or do I delete them before updating the drivers on the new one after it's been physically installed?

2. My motherboard is here (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813136066). It says I can use DDR3 1333 RAM, Can I use DDR3 1600? And what's up with the timing? An example is here (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428). It says the timing is 9-9-9-24. What the hell does that mean? lol.

Thanks!

Anenome
09-13-2011, 11:21 AM
1. Uninstall the old drivers before installing new card. You want a fresh install with the new one, and the mobo will just default to its initial video mode until you install the new drivers.

2. 9-9-9-24 timing is standard fare these days for memory. Basically the timing is the clock timing, or how many clock cycles the memory needs to do basic operations. You can get big improvements in performance by using lower clock speeds with memory that's rated for it, but it's obviously more expensive.

But, if you go some, let's say, 7-8-7-24 memory, and it was ddr3 1333, it could perform as fast as ddr3 at 1600 or higher.

So, buying better timed-rating memory simply improves memory performance, but you're going to have to play with the settings on the mobo if it doesn't automatically detect better timings (which even mine didn't). If you have the standard 9-9-9-24 timing, there's no need to fiddle with settings.

So, it's a power-feature for someone trying to squeeze even more performance out of a system. My memory is 7-8-7-24, and ddr3 1600, but because of the timing is equivalent in speed to ddr3 2000.

Just make damn sure your mobo is capable of running the memory at the faster timing! I had to go to my maker's website and make sure it could take those timings with the manufacturer I bought from. That was probably the most research-heavy thing I had to do when buying my parts. Good luck!

sai tyrus
09-13-2011, 12:06 PM
Cool. Thank you!

Jambe
09-16-2011, 02:30 PM
A 1050W PSU is about 50% overkill for the listed build. If you're spending that kinda cash anyway, you might as well step up to a Gold certified unit from Corsair, or better yet one from Corsair's high-end OEM Seasonic.

Seasonic's X750 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151087) is $160. The X-series PSUs are especially nice in that their fans only spin when they need to; at idle up through around 50% load (depending on ambient temperatures) they just don't generate enough heat to warrant the fan spinning. Silence!

Plus, you'd then have $60 to put towards a nicer case or more RAM or some spiffy peripherals or fans or whatever.

By all means, spend the money. It's not my money! But you could spend it more wisely on different components of the build and get more use out of it.