Every massacre is different in their own right. But the meida (news) likes to sling games into it. I for one have been gaming now for the vast majority of my life. My parents got me into them when I was very young, and its been a thing ever since. I have killed hundreds of thousands virtual things in my life time between all the games I have played, and never once, have I gotten the urge to want to kill someone.
Now, you talk about the person shooting up dead bodies, that is very much a mental health issue. A lot of people like to say video games desensitizes the individual from the act they are carrying out in the game. Now I have hunted in my life time, and to this day, I have a hard time killing something just to kill something. I dont understand that in people. Not mention, how many of us that have played Call of Duty cringed and felt horrible, playing the airport scene.
Playing that scene, I was disgusted in myself. I didn't want to do it, and these are just virtual people. The kind of brain that can shut out emotion like that, is the kind of brain that needs help. If people want to defend guns and say they aren't dangerous, its the individual using them, why can't the same apply here. I think we all can agree because we all are gamers, that games dont kill people.
I can understand most arguments against it, but at the same time, the people that have killed are radicals in the equation. The 1%. I tried to put myself in the kid that shot up Sandy Hook, what it was to walk into the school armed, what it might have been like looking at the first room, and the only reaction I got was, I could never do any of that. I couldn't pull the trigger on innocent life. They had no reason to be shot. None. The worst crime they committed was probably throwing a tantrum for a toy.
Video games, violent media, or music aren't the problem, its the individual that is abusing them. And as a country we need to stand up and say, we need help with are mental health problem in the United States and need to take action. More or less of anything else of something whether its a game or a gun, isn't the answer. Its mental health. And the treatment of that. That is the thing that is going to save lives.
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Originally Posted by lockwoodx
Why the fuck do people care about guns anyways? Oh right... they equal a penis.
Every massacre is different in their own right. But the meida (news) likes to sling games into it. I for one have been gaming now for the vast majority of my life. My parents got me into them when I was very young, and its been a thing ever since. I have killed hundreds of thousands virtual things in my life time between all the games I have played, and never once, have I gotten the urge to want to kill someone.
Okay. The same can be said for firearms. Does owning a firearm in and of itself make someone want to kill other people? No. You claim to own firearms but also claim to have never had the urge to kill people.
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Now, you talk about the person shooting up dead bodies, that is very much a mental health issue. A lot of people like to say video games desensitizes the individual from the act they are carrying out in the game. Now I have hunted in my life time, and to this day, I have a hard time killing something just to kill something. I dont understand that in people. Not mention, how many of us that have played Call of Duty cringed and felt horrible, playing the airport scene.
So here is the problem, you're citing that you had an emotional response to a game.. the airport scene. You also bring up the mental health issue of someone essentially mutilating bodies by shooting them up when they are already dead. If someone is that mentally disturbed is it possible that someone who plays video games in which one certain missions you're merely shooting up unarmed civilians (to be fair you don't have to play that game, that mission in the game or even shoot civilians if you are playing the mission)? I'm not a mental health professional, I can't personally say either way. I don't believe that it would be too far of a jump for a mentally disturbed person to get used to that kind of destruction because they see it in video games.
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Playing that scene, I was disgusted in myself. I didn't want to do it, and these are just virtual people. The kind of brain that can shut out emotion like that, is the kind of brain that needs help. If people want to defend guns and say they aren't dangerous, its the individual using them, why can't the same apply here. I think we all can agree because we all are gamers, that games dont kill people.
What about the people that can not only merely shut off emotion (I personally was able to realize it's merely a game and not get disgusted) but rather it excites them?
I can only speak for myself when I say that I do not believe games are killing people. I have never made that claim. The point of it all is that people are quick to point at an inanimate object that merely shoots when you pull a trigger, it can't speak, it isn't "art", it isn't meant to be anything other than a tool versus games/movies/"art" that is meant to invoke an emotional response.
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Video games, violent media, or music aren't the problem, its the individual that is abusing them. And as a country we need to stand up and say, we need help with are mental health problem in the United States and need to take action. More or less of anything else of something whether its a game or a gun, isn't the answer. Its mental health. And the treatment of that. That is the thing that is going to save lives.
This is essentially what people have been posting on this forum for awhile now. Most people here that are standing up for the 2nd amendment are not saying ban video games. The argument being made is no matter if guns or video games are involved it takes a person to commit these crimes. If we are truly looking to try and prevent these types of tragedies (which I don't believe you ever will be able to completely prevent) then we should look at everything.
People are quick to bring up adding further gun control but those advocating not punishing law abiding citizens continue to call for further gun bans, contols, limits. We then are able to cite clear examples of where further gun control has done nothing... besides possibly helping to create more gun crime. The UK is a constant example thrown up that gun control works... but when you look at the numbers you see a rise in murders after the ban, a rise in gun crime after the ban, a continuation of gun related crime. They also have socialized medicine, they also have far less violence in their media. It's unfortunate but the honest truth is no matter what safe guards are in place there will be murders, death.
People are quick to say it's silly to blame crime on a game.. it takes a person to commit a crime. Yet constantly there are this same group of people blaming firearms, which I have pointed out don't talk to you, don't try and invoke an emotional response, etc. Everyone talks about mental health but is ignoring that many of these shooters were seeing mental health professionals prior to the shooting, many of them were on medication from these professionals and it did not stop the killings.
So what we can see is with further gun controls, even outright bans, massacres with firearms have occurred. Mental health care has been in use of the several of the shooters involved and they were even prescribed medications (known to cause suicidal thoughts, among other symptoms) that went on killing sprees. We know that making it so people were unable to adequately defend themselves has lead to deaths. We know massacres have occurred well before firearms, video games, movies, etc. So my question is when are we going to look at the source? Maybe there are always people that will desire the fame of these acts, the misguided satisfaction from this violence, etc?
Millions of people every year drunk drive, they know over many people are killed by this (most probably don't realize it's over 10,000 Americans every year), they know that you can get locked up for it, they know you can get fined, lose your job, etc. Yet no one is blaming a substance, known to be addictive, for all of this carnage, death, lost property, broken lives, etc. No we blame the dirt bags, that are often addicts, for driving. What about the aspects in this that consider it "cool" to do? I know several individuals whom joke openly about all the times they used to drunk drive in high school and college.
Now to come back into the realm of media. When I was growing up I watched reruns of cheers, I watched all sorts of shows like that. When I was a kid I used to believe that from your mid 20 to your late 30s it was the social norm to go to a bar, drink every night and hangout with your friends (which ignores the severe cost of drinking out, health risks, alcohol addiction, etc). I "learned' this just by watching TV. My parents didn't do that, they thought it was a funny show however. Now I never fell into this loop of oh it's 5:30 I'm supposed to be at the bar (look at How I Met Your Mother... it takes place a large % in a bar). So is it too far of a jump for young kids to see something in a show, a movie, a game and think that's how it's supposed to be? How many fight clubs were created after "Fight Club"? How many kids listen to lyrics of songs and think hey for me to be as successful as Jay-Z I have be a hustler, a gangsta, and sling drugs? Hopefully not many but I'm doubtful.
So what we do know for sure is that media absolutely affects how people act.. everything for the slang used, to the clothes we wear to expectations in many cases. Increasingly media has been the baby sitter of probably the last two or more generations. We know government funded neighborhoods are nothing more than war zones.
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Originally Posted by Johan
Valve hasn't stripped anyone of anything.
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Originally Posted by lockwoodx
Steam has always been 100% voluntary. Origin.... not so much.
Venom did you expect a civilian to understand death without seeing another human being get killed before their eyes? He is scared and irrational; somebody's gotta blame somebody.
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Originally Posted by Capt_Thad
heh I believe you may be suggesting that giving up used games in favor of exclusive 3rd party support excites you sexually.
Venom did you expect a civilian to understand death without seeing another human being get killed before their eyes? He is scared and irrational; somebody's gotta blame somebody.
I don't really expect him to, I just like to discuss this topic.
I just find it interesting the circles that we kind of go in on the subject. In some places we have pulling calling for *further* gun control (while stating it as just calling *for* gun control which already exists). People keep referring to AR15s as high powered, assault weapons with no real understanding what that means and why they aren't assault weapons. People talk about the armor piercing capability of the AR15's rounds... ignoring that applies to .22, .308, 30-06, etc and wasn't due to the fact that shooters were using special ammo (they weren't to my understanding.. just a high velocity round, which is a .22 as well as a .223, will pass right through a vest... as will a knife).
They also seem to try and cite the UK as a shining example of gun controls (in their case essentially an outright ban) working... due to a low gun homicide #.. but ignoring they had a low gun homicide number before the ban (and in many cases lower). They also ignore that gun crime spiked nearly 90% following the gun ban and ignore gun massacres still occurring after the ban.
So even when people point this out, they will ask why isn't "everything on the table"... but if you bring up the violent games, movies, etc a normal response is "movies/games don't kill people.. people do" but that same thought isn't applied to guns. I guess I'll put it this way. I'd be more worried about why people get to the point of murdering schools full of children than trying to take away every tool that can be used to accomplish this... because there are nearly endless amounts of tools, besides guns, that can do this (and have in the past).
Another normal point to hear from the people advocating for further gun control is "it's worth it if it saves just one life". Okay.. that sounds great.. but it hasn't saved anyone in Chicago, the UK, etc. If they really feel that way why will they not move to ban all violent games, movies, etc?.. Clearly if just the possibility of saving one life (which is misguided and incorrect in my opinion and supported through evidence) then why not ban violent movies/games if it may prevent someone from snapping, getting an addiction to violence, etc?
So Pope, I know we are on the same "side" on this issue (which tends to be the case) and this was a long winded response (as usual) but this is why I bother engaging with people who haven't experienced it and thus can't grasp it.
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Originally Posted by Johan
Valve hasn't stripped anyone of anything.
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Originally Posted by lockwoodx
Steam has always been 100% voluntary. Origin.... not so much.
I don't think they ever will. The media they seem to blame for everything has brainwashed them (ironically) into vilifying an object that is meant to preserve and take lives.
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Originally Posted by Capt_Thad
heh I believe you may be suggesting that giving up used games in favor of exclusive 3rd party support excites you sexually.
I don't think they ever will. The media they seem to blame for everything has brainwashed them (ironically) into vilifying an object that is meant to preserve and take lives.
Well as they say: You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.
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Originally Posted by Johan
Valve hasn't stripped anyone of anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lockwoodx
Steam has always been 100% voluntary. Origin.... not so much.
I don't think they ever will. The media they seem to blame for everything has brainwashed them (ironically) into vilifying an object that is meant to preserve and take lives.
You act like I am saying guns are the culprit. When I am saying that they are just the tool. You all are fucktards and it is pointless to even talk to either Venom of Pope... Therefore, adios, no point to continue seeing your posts if you can't talk to either. I would rather talk to a wall. So blocking both ya. Enjoy yourselves.
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Originally Posted by lockwoodx
Why the fuck do people care about guns anyways? Oh right... they equal a penis.
You act like I am saying guns are the culprit. When I am saying that they are just the tool. You all are fucktards and it is pointless to even talk to either Venom of Pope... Therefore, adios, no point to continue seeing your posts if you can't talk to either. I would rather talk to a wall. So blocking both ya. Enjoy yourselves.
Look mijo, you come here and troll half your way through 2 threads and then I decide to bust your ass and you go insane then Venom again (I don't know why he bothers) calmly points his position all of his posts are ALWAYS followed by I DON'T HAVE TO ANSWER TO YOUR POSTS WAAAHHHHH!
Go ahead and "block us". Also might as well change your custom title to "Always a bitch." It suits you.
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Originally Posted by Capt_Thad
heh I believe you may be suggesting that giving up used games in favor of exclusive 3rd party support excites you sexually.
