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Old 11-13-2018, 12:04 PM   #21
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I agree completely. I just felt it an opportune moment to remind everyone what a complete cunt terran is.
Stuff a maxi up there Jan. You're bleeding all over the damn place.
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Old 11-13-2018, 01:46 PM   #22
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Remember when Prince died
No, not really. Was that the addict dude who offed himself through an overdose?



On the bright side, you offered an opportunity for lefty chimpy...let's call him Limpie...to introduce a dose of the leftist screeching and hissing about Stan Lee, a guy who was actually for equality when it cost something to be for it (in the 60s!) and when equality meant actual equality of opportunity, not leftist lunacy like anti-Asian Harvard admissions practices or white male proggies trying to steal black or female 'privileges' by magically becoming them, lol.
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Old 11-13-2018, 02:02 PM   #23
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On the bright side, you offered an opportunity for lefty chimpy...let's call him Limpie...to introduce a dose of the leftist screeching and hissing about Stan Lee, a guy who was actually for equality when it cost something to be for it (in the 60s!) and when equality meant actual equality of opportunity, not leftist lunacy like anti-Asian Harvard admissions practices or white male proggies trying to steal black or female 'privileges' by magically becoming them, lol.
Oh, please. The man was integral to Marvel and the progressive messages he gave a platform to were extremely important. None of this is diminished by the shit he pulled with Kirby and Ditko...but that stuff still happened. Regardless, the messages he was trying to send with books like Black Panther and X-Men were - and still are - very important.

I love how you conveniently glossed over my actual point: "This really isn't the time to be focusing on the negative aspects like that. He contributed a great deal - more than most creators could ever dream of - to the cultural zeitgeist and had a hand in creating an entire pantheon of characters that are still beloved to this day. It's easy to hone in on the negative with people like Stan Lee...but it feels more important to remember the positive aspects about the people who influenced the lives of millions in the immediate days after their deaths."

If you actually read what I wrote, you would have realized I was calling for the exact opposite of what you accused me of doing. We should be focusing on the good Stan Lee did over the years, not the negative shit.
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Old 11-13-2018, 02:08 PM   #24
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I love how you conveniently glossed over my actual point: "This really isn't the time to be focusing on the negative aspects like that.
Lying liars and the lies they lie.

Are you a politician? lolololol.
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Old 11-13-2018, 02:14 PM   #25
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Is context a foreign concept to you? Look at the conversation and the context of what I wrote. It was referencing the response to Prince's death and stuff that people were saying about him at the time.

Like I said, it's easy to dredge up negative shit about people after they die. It doesn't mean we should and - in the case of Stan Lee - I don't even want to. He had a hand in creating some of my favorite characters; why would I want to trash him?
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Old 11-13-2018, 02:17 PM   #26
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Like I said, it's easy to dredge up negative shit about people after they die. It doesn't mean we should
Yet you did just what you said shouldn't be done. It wasn't even necessary to make your point, yet you did it.

Own it, Limpie!
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Old 11-13-2018, 02:38 PM   #27
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Yet you did just what you said shouldn't be done. It wasn't even necessary to make your point, yet you did it.

Own it, Limpie!
There's nothing for me to own, because the entire point behind bringing that subject up (and how can it be brought up without actually being brought up?) wasn't actually related to Lee at all.

By all means, continue linking Trump's favorite rhetorical device, as if it's actually some sort of argument-winning tactic. You missed the point entirely.

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Yea, you look at where comics are at right now and there are very few characters that were created past the 60’s and even fewer that have had any cultural impact. Harley Quinn is about the only new character in decades that didn’t end up being a throw away. (And probably Ghost Rider before that.)

With all the indie stuff Image, IDW and Dark Horse crank out you would think there would be the next Spider-Man, Hulk or FF in there somewhere and there just isn’t. (Not that I am saying I would do better, FWIW.)

Lee was just one of a kind and a pleasure to watch and hear from on top of the creativity. If the worst thing anyone says about you is that when you were 94 you were hitting on your 20-year-old nurses, you had a pretty good run.
There was something about the 60's and 70's that really seemed to help spark creativity to heights we haven't really seen since. I think much of it could be chalked up to the "rules" not being set in stone at all; they were making it up as they went and everything was new. By the time we hit the 80's and 90's, most of these characters and settings had been around for 20-30+ years and their status quo had been firmly established. Leading up to this, creators weren't afraid to experiment and try crazy things.

The same thing happened across the Pacific with the Godzilla series; the 60's and 70's movies (while not always of the highest quality) were pretty crazy and experimental. They tried all sorts of weird stuff, for better or worse. When the series was rebooted in '84, they brought things back to basics...but the movies from the 90's were pretty much just gussied-up copies of stuff done in the 60's and 70's. Instead of getting experimental, they rehashed the same handful of popular characters they knew would put asses in seats. The second reboot series starting in 2000 wasn't much different, either; the most popular movies were more rehashes of Mechagodzilla.

For some reason, it's almost as if people are afraid to experiment the way they used to. To some degree, their audiences stopped wanting to see that sort of thing, as well.
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Old 11-13-2018, 03:24 PM   #28
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Oh, please. The man was integral to Marvel and the progressive messages he gave a platform to were extremely important. None of this is diminished by the shit he pulled with Kirby and Ditko...but that stuff still happened. Regardless, the messages he was trying to send with books like Black Panther and X-Men were - and still are - very important.

I love how you conveniently glossed over my actual point: "This really isn't the time to be focusing on the negative aspects like that. He contributed a great deal - more than most creators could ever dream of - to the cultural zeitgeist and had a hand in creating an entire pantheon of characters that are still beloved to this day. It's easy to hone in on the negative with people like Stan Lee...but it feels more important to remember the positive aspects about the people who influenced the lives of millions in the immediate days after their deaths."

If you actually read what I wrote, you would have realized I was calling for the exact opposite of what you accused me of doing. We should be focusing on the good Stan Lee did over the years, not the negative shit.
And yet Terran isn't wrong, Stan Lee did it in a time where he was actually fighting for civil rights. What lefties are doing today is honestly pushing white genocide because it's trendy to hate white people, and because liberals are so fucking cucked and guilty over slavery that happened before any of them were even born while ignoring that the majority of slave trading throughout history has actually been Islam (guess what they still have slaves today) and the Jews its actually quite ridiculous to keep on this whole "White people are evil" kick the left is on. Again skin color doesn't matter a fucking thing, what you do, what your character is, that's what's important.
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Old 11-13-2018, 03:31 PM   #29
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And yet Terran isn't wrong, Stan Lee did it in a time where he was actually fighting for civil rights. What lefties are doing today is honestly pushing white genocide because it's trendy to hate white people, and because liberals are so fucking cucked and guilty over slavery that happened before any of them were even born while ignoring that the majority of slave trading throughout history has actually been Islam (guess what they still have slaves today) and the Jews its actually quite ridiculous to keep on this whole "White people are evil" kick the left is on. Again skin color doesn't matter a fucking thing, what you do, what your character is, that's what's important.
I never once said Terran was wrong with his assessment of Stan Lee in regards to his progressive views with books like X-Men. I agree with that wholeheartedly.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:09 PM   #30
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There was something about the 60's and 70's that really seemed to help spark creativity to heights we haven't really seen since. I think much of it could be chalked up to the "rules" not being set in stone at all; they were making it up as they went and everything was new. By the time we hit the 80's and 90's, most of these characters and settings had been around for 20-30+ years and their status quo had been firmly established. Leading up to this, creators weren't afraid to experiment and try crazy things.
I disagree, there is plenty of creativity now. I mean we have tons of great shit being made all over the place in movies, TV, Books, and yes, comics.

But maybe some of it hasn't hit the full mainstream. Or you are just feeling nostalgic, or you aren't considering bodies of work which have evolved on their own right.

Now some people will call a lot of the original work today "derivative", for example something like Avatar "Dances with Aliens" or something or the Matrix pulls influence from this or that Jim Butcher's Dresden is based on something similar to blah blah blah or Patrick Rothfuss is just writing a better version of this other guys story of blah.

This even covers the sometimes sneaky pushing boundaries "agenda" characters showing up. They can be done well but brazenly (ala the XMen) or subtly introduced but you see this happening with original LGBTQ characters all the time. They have gotten to the point where the characters seem more natural and less forced (take Wavererly from Wynnoa Earp, for example) though some people see that as dastardly in and of itself.

There is plenty of cutting edge, pushing the needle, creativity everywhere in all media if you look through all the chaff.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:52 PM   #31
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There's nothing for me to own
You can say 'we shouldn't air a laundry list of a dead person's faults' without listing one...or several...or ANY at all.

As you said:

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Reams of paper have been written about Lee and his questionable practices over the years regarding his showmanship and his penchant for, shall we say, "overenthusiastic crediting" in regards to his own contributions to things. The Kirby and Ditko camps have what many would consider to be legitimate beefs with Lee. But...
"But..." lol. "But..."

Own it. YOU DID IT.
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Old 11-13-2018, 06:07 PM   #32
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You can say 'we shouldn't air a laundry list of a dead person's faults' without listing one...or several...or ANY at all.

As you said:



"But..." lol. "But..."

Own it. YOU DID IT.

And you're still missing the point behind why I even mentioned any of that in the first place.

It had nothing to do with Stan Lee.
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Old 11-13-2018, 07:31 PM   #33
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It had nothing to do with Stan Lee.
You, doing what you say you didn't do:

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...about Lee and his questionable practices...
lulz .
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Old 11-13-2018, 07:34 PM   #34
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lulz .
Right? I was wondering if Chimp forgot what he actually posted above to you, because that's exactly what he accused you of, of course then walked back on it instantly. Typical progressive.
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Old 11-13-2018, 07:48 PM   #35
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There was something about the 60's and 70's that really seemed to help spark creativity to heights we haven't really seen since. I think much of it could be chalked up to the "rules" not being set in stone at all; they were making it up as they went and everything was new. By the time we hit the 80's and 90's, most of these characters and settings had been around for 20-30+ years and their status quo had been firmly established. Leading up to this, creators weren't afraid to experiment and try crazy things.
Some of it is the fans, we want more Spider-Man and more Batman and we kinda refuse to let them create anyone else. I read Invincible and I own the hardcovers, but it died after a while because the character just wasn't all that unique.

I'm also being remiss that I left out Watchmen, which was somewhat based on old Charlton Comics characters, but really spun them out into totally original creations and has had a massive impact on the comics industry as a whole (If you listen to the current douchebags running DC comics, Watchmen destroyed the industry...)

It is still a time when there is room for creativity with Image & IDW allowing creators to retain their rights, but few people have that boundless creative energy that Lee, Kirby and Ditko (and a few others) had in the 60's.

Some of that is market driven, IDW & Image pretty much refuse to publish super hero comics (Growing pains from the 90's, Spawn/Savage Dragon/etc) and that keeps the industry from moving forward. They tend to focus now on mostly horror comics.
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:35 PM   #36
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Right? I was wondering if Chimp forgot what he actually posted above to you, because that's exactly what he accused you of, of course then walked back on it instantly. Typical progressive.
If the two of you can't grasp the context of what I said, that's not my fault. It was an example what he was doing for another celebrity death.

If the two of you can't grasp what my actual opinion of the man is, that's not my fault. It's written in plain text and there isn't anything to "walk back".
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Old 11-14-2018, 02:13 PM   #37
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my fault
Yes, it is. Next time, no need to engage in a rhetorically fallacious attempt at character assassination "about Lee and his questionable practices."

Apophasis is only good for politicians and assholes. Pardon me for the repetition.
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Old 11-14-2018, 07:06 PM   #38
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Yes, it is. Next time, no need to engage in a rhetorically fallacious attempt at character assassination "about Lee and his questionable practices."
If you think that is what I was actually doing, you're either being intentionally oblivious or you're just legitimately stupid. I know you're not stupid.
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Old 11-14-2018, 07:25 PM   #39
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And you continue to do this, lol.

Read the definition. It is exactly what you did in the post I keep referring to. lololol, you are hilarious!
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Old 11-14-2018, 11:05 PM   #40
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If you think that is what I was actually doing, you're either being intentionally oblivious or you're just legitimately stupid. I know you're not stupid.
You called someone out for shitting on Stan Lee, while you proceeded to shit on Stan Lee to begin with. Own it and move on.
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