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Old 02-16-2018, 08:43 PM   #121
vallor
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Oh yeah, no Americans implicated in Russian collusion! How about them apples?
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Old 02-16-2018, 08:49 PM   #122
SpectralThundr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vallor View Post
Oh yeah, no Americans implicated in Russian collusion! How about them apples?
We knew that to begin with. Now where's the special investigation for Obama's collusion and uranium selling?
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Old 02-16-2018, 10:46 PM   #123
Terran
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Oh yeah, no Americans implicated in Russian collusion! How about them apples?
Didn't you get the progressive memo? We've moved on from "collusion with Russia" to obstruction...obstruction of an investigation into something that didn't and doesn't exist (Trump collusion with Russia) while ignoring the actual collusion of progressives and foreigners to destroy our current president.

Just like they used the IRS to impede and destroy conservative groups.
Just like they used the ATF to illegally run guns into Mexico, getting an American and Mexicans killed.
Just like they used the FBI and DOJ to whitewash Hillary's illegal handling of classified info.
Just like they used the State Dept to whitewash the deaths of American diplomatic personnel in Libya.
Just like they fight for foreigners present here illegally over and above American citizens and legal residents.
Just like they don't want to give you any more of your money...ahem, crumbs...because the damn gummit should have it instead!
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Old 02-17-2018, 05:39 AM   #124
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You forgot the part in Libya where they had their grand poobah killed, creating a power vacuum, enabling both the European migrant crisis as well as the Libyan open air slave market.
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Old 02-17-2018, 07:14 AM   #125
Terran
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You forgot the part in Libya where they had their grand poobah killed, creating a power vacuum, enabling both the European migrant crisis as well as the Libyan open air slave market.
That, and also:

Just like they ignored the Syrian collapse and Russia's reentry into the Middle East, creating ISIS, the worst migrant crisis since WWII, and the deaths of millions because they didn't want to hamper their prospects for a terrible nuclear deal with Iran that has actually pushed us closer to war in the Middle East than we've been in fifty years.

Bang up job by Obumbles and his Idiocracy.

I'm also especially fond of the lamestream democrat media focusing so much on Trump's personal sexual predilections (individual sexual autonomy is suddenly bad...BAD! ). Didn't hear much about Obumbles drug use as a young adult, but....you know...that wasn't news, lol.
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Old 03-13-2018, 03:56 AM   #126
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House Intelligence Report released on Monday. Here's some of the high points including no noticeable preference from Putin for the Trump campaign nor no findings of collusion between Trump's campaign and Russia.

Quote:
Overview
Following a more than yearlong, bipartisan investigation into Russia active measures targeting the 2016 U.S.
election, the House Intelligence Committee has completed a draft report of 150+ pages, with 600+ citations.

The draft report addresses, in detail, each of the questions within the agreed parameters of the investigation, as
announced in March 2017. It analyzes:
 Russian active measures directed against the 2016 U.S. election and against our European allies;
 The U.S. government response to that attack;
 Links between Russians and the Trump and Clinton campaigns; and
 Purported leaks of classified information.

Initial Findings
The draft report contains 40+ initial findings that describe:
 A pattern of Russian attacks on America’s European allies;
 Russian cyberattacks on U.S. political institutions in 2015-2016 and their use of social media to sow discord;
 A lackluster pre-election response to Russian active measures;
 Concurrence with the Intelligence Community Assessment’s judgments, except with respect to Putin’s supposed preference for candidate Trump;

 We have found no evidence of collusion, coordination, or conspiracy between the Trump campaign and the Russians;

 How anti-Trump research made its way from Russian sources to the Clinton campaign; and
 Problematic contacts between senior Intelligence Community officials and the media.
Emphasis mine.
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Old 03-13-2018, 04:57 AM   #127
Terran
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Does not matter; the fishing will continue. This was never about facts, it's always been about politically damaging the president and his agenda. While the Dems have certainly slow-walked his political appointees they've been unable to do much of anything otherwise.
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Old 03-13-2018, 11:25 AM   #128
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Uhh, ok, now can we address Russian meddling?
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Old 03-13-2018, 12:45 PM   #129
Terran
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Uhh, ok, now can we address Russian meddling?
So it's not collusion any longer? Has that lost its luster?



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Old 03-14-2018, 06:28 AM   #130
vallor
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Uhh, ok, now can we address Russian meddling?
This is addressed as part of the report. You can see both social media and other vectors are discussed in the PDF including cyber attacks which mostly deal with non-federal government servers (e.g. the DNC is not a federal government controlled infrastruture).

I guess 13 trolls and a online ads stuffed on Twitter and Facebook among all the other junk like “Are you Single? Jenny is only 2.5 Miles from your location!” And “Cash for your old jewelry!” dross on Twitter and Facebook doesn’t phase me as “meddling”.

What exactly is it about this that has you so super dooper concerned above and beyond the meddling we know they’ve done in every other election we’ve had where it had equally little success? Is it because Trump won this time and you really really don’t like him? It seemed to be fine when Obama won. Nobody bitched about it then.

I think:
1) It would be hypocritical of the USA to insist only OUR elections be pristine of meddling. If we are going to insist on no meddling then it should be our policy and practice to also not meddle in other countries political process. Which we do plenty of and should stop.

2) How can we insist no meddling from foreign nationals via social media and so on when we, on this very site, talk about world politics? At what point does someone having a discussion become someone being a troll become someone as a political agent of another country?

3) What right does the US government have to tell private companies what to accept as business? Now, it might be a good idea to create rules which force disclosure of political messaging for other governments (apparently Facebook and Twitter were very well aware of who was buying the adspace) in the same way PACs and Candidates have to identify the source of the funding for any particular ad.

But is there any reason Russia or Outer Mongolia SHOULDN’T be able to give Facebook some money and let them know they’re a valued trading partner and it would be a good deal if Joe Biden won the presidency in 2020 as long as we knew it was being funded by “Kajackistanis for More Pictures of Creepy “Uncle” Joe Biden Making Little Girls Uncomfortable”?
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Old 03-14-2018, 06:52 AM   #131
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Without editing my post: my point is this election and “meddling” doesn’t seem like it is any more egregious than any which has happened in the past.

I am not sure there’s a way to stop it, and I’m not sure we should try to. The very idea that our government would pull a “do what I say and not what I do” move seems disingenuous at best.

The thought a foreign agent would actually tag their undercover political ad with anything like “The content of this ad was paid for by the Iran Mullas for Elizabeth Warren in Iran” is probably laughable.

Is it disturbing to think another government could be having some sway over our elections? Maybe this is just another cost of Globalization. Politics has been influenced by globalization why shouldn’t the elections themselves?

A government is just a collection of people with an agenda supposedly based on the will of the governed. Are the USA and UK guilty of “meddling” in the recent EU political landscape?

Trump’s election combined with Brexit could be considered a massive version of global “meddling” with the entire mainstream media aiding and abetting. It fueled dangerously close populist elections in France, Austria, and Germany to the point where some very desperate alliances had to be formed to retain power for the elites.

In Italy the populist movements are actually making headway despite the entire opposition of “people who know what’s best”.
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