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Old 10-07-2016, 07:08 AM   #1
BeardedSonOfNel
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Valve Ordered To Stop Supporting Black-Market Gambling


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The Washington State Gambling Commission has taken action against Bellevue game maker Valve, the first time a U.S. regulator has attempted to crack down on a multibillion-dollar online gambling market that uses virtual items earned in video games as currency.

“In Washington, and everywhere in the United States, skins betting on sports remains a large, unregulated black market for gambling,” Commissioner Chris Stearns said in a statement. “And that carries great risk for the players who remain wholly unprotected in an unregulated environment.”

In a cease-and-desist letter to Valve Chief Executive Officer Gabe Newell, commission director David Trujillo said the company didn’t respond to requests for more information after a meeting in February. If the firm doesn’t comply with gambling laws, the commission could seize any property related to illegal gambling activities, according to the letter.

The gambling takes place on websites that are mostly small and based overseas. Valve, on the other hand, is a powerhouse of the video-game industry that publishes the best-selling game Counter-Strike: Global Offensive. The company has taken action in recent months against the gambling sites, but the commission’s letter makes clear those steps weren’t enough. It also supports a common opinion in the industry that this form of gambling couldn’t exist without Valve’s implicit approval.
Via The Seattle Times
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Old 10-07-2016, 07:15 AM   #2
screwyluie
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while I do believe Valve can and is doing something about this gambling problem, I don't see how it's their responsibility legally.

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The company has taken action in recent months against the gambling sites, but the commission’s letter makes clear those steps weren’t enough
it shut down those sites, clearly it was enough.

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It also supports a common opinion in the industry that this form of gambling couldn’t exist without Valve’s implicit approval
this is horseshit. Valve makes a product and that product has a market value. Just because someone decides to gamble with it doesn't mean valve is approving. This is akin to things like gambling with magic cards (which is a real thing and almost identical) or anything else with real money value.
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Old 10-07-2016, 11:10 AM   #3
Fubl
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What's different between this and a sports leagues wink wink nod nod on gambling.
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Old 10-07-2016, 12:12 PM   #4
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Valve knew this was coming.
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Old 10-07-2016, 12:35 PM   #5
Terran
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Get the government out of it. If people are so mathematically/statistically challenged that they want to blow their money on gambling, let them. We don't stop stupid people from reproducing. Why should we stop them from gambling? Leave people alone already.
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Old 10-07-2016, 01:05 PM   #6
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What about what Valve does is gambling? Is it the totally silly Steam card market?
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Old 10-07-2016, 04:55 PM   #7
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What about what Valve does is gambling? Is it the totally silly Steam card market?
Even worse weapons skins......
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Old 10-08-2016, 09:19 AM   #8
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I grew up reading Spiderman comics and I always thought Dr. Octapus looked silly because he had a haircut that NOBODY would have in real life.

Apparently Gabs Newell read the same comics and instead thought, "That guy looks AMAZING".
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Old 10-08-2016, 09:20 AM   #9
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Old 10-08-2016, 11:15 AM   #10
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Get the government out of it. If people are so mathematically/statistically challenged that they want to blow their money on gambling, let them. We don't stop stupid people from reproducing. Why should we stop them from gambling? Leave people alone already.
It has nothing to do with stopping people from gambling and everything to do with ensuring the government get's their "fair share" of the money. This is why lotteries are illegal...unless they're being run by states.

It's the same reasoning behind why bootlegging is still illegal; the government wants its tax and licensing fees associated with alcohol production and sales.

The government doesn't care if people gamble; they just want their cut of the profits.
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Old 10-08-2016, 01:15 PM   #11
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The government doesn't care if people gamble
Horseshit. Complete and utter nonsense. You know how I know? Every state has differing laws on which forms of gambling are allowed and which are not, completely irrespective of the potential for state revenues from those forms of gambling. The federal government is the same.

Get the MOFO government out of people's business. Stupid people should be free to be stupid.
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Old 10-09-2016, 11:41 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by screwyluie View Post

...

this is horseshit. Valve makes a product and that product has a market value. Just because someone decides to gamble with it doesn't mean valve is approving. This is akin to things like gambling with magic cards (which is a real thing and almost identical) or anything else with real money value.
Except people involved have stated that Valve has actively supported these operations. In April Bloomberg did a piece on CSGO gambling and included this bit:
These sites, while independently run, use Valve’s software and pay out in skins. Valve employees also communicate with CSGO Lounge and have given technical support to the site, said Courtney Timpson, a community administrator and spokesman for CSGO Lounge. The Valve logo is prominently displayed on the site, and in one post on its forum, a moderator addresses people—especially the “younger audience”—who feel that they have been scammed. “If something is wrong, don’t post on the forums; contact Valve/Steam,” the moderator writes.
If Valve is actively providing technical support to these betting sites, and permitting them to run bot accounts that collect the bets, then hold them before disbursing winnings they are actively supporting this activity.

My biggest concern with all this is frankly the IRS. In years past they have rumbled that virtual goods have real currency values, and thus should be considered when taxable assets are being calculated. Having virtual items become taxable objects (and the transfer of them taxable transactions) is something that I think nobody in gaming wants.
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Old 10-09-2016, 01:52 PM   #13
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If Valve is actively providing technical support to these betting sites, and permitting them to run bot accounts that collect the bets, then hold them b
So the hell what. Seriously, is it your money people are spending? Leave them alone. If the government wants a cut, let them pass legislation mandating it by law. Otherwise, GTFO and leave people alone to make their own decisions.

:facepalm: on this entire topic. It's idiotic, treating people like dirty little criminals or children in need of fences around their behavior. Let them spend their money stupidly if they wish.
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Old 10-09-2016, 02:20 PM   #14
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The problem, the only problem with this whole thing is regulation. There are regulations on gambling for a reason(s). We need to keep kids from doing it (which is a big issue with csgo gambling). We need to keep the gambling site fair, honest, and the winning/losing needs to be balanced.

Oh and providing tech support is not proof of approval. That's about the most asinine thing I've heard today.
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Old 10-09-2016, 02:35 PM   #15
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"We" need to keep kids from doing it? Nope, not my job. My job is to keep MY kids from doing it (and they don't!). It's not my responsibility to keep your kids or anyone else's from 'doing' this or that or any other thing. You brought them into the world, do your damn job so others don't have to do it for you.
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Old 10-09-2016, 03:13 PM   #16
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"We" need to keep kids from doing it? Nope, not my job. My job is to keep MY kids from doing it (and they don't!). It's not my responsibility to keep your kids or anyone else's from 'doing' this or that or any other thing. You brought them into the world, do your damn job so others don't have to do it for you.
trust me terran, no one ever includes you in the statement 'We'.
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Old 10-09-2016, 05:39 PM   #17
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trust me terran, no one ever includes you in the statement 'We'.
He isn't wrong though. Why do people want the government to run their lives for them and be big daddy when all that's really needed in life is some personal responsibility for yourself?
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Old 10-09-2016, 05:54 PM   #18
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trust me terran, no one ever includes you in the statement 'We'.
As long as we're on the same page! I'm not an "It takes a village" moron, thank you. It doesn't take a village. It takes a damn family, with responsible parents.
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Old 10-09-2016, 09:50 PM   #19
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He isn't wrong though. Why do people want the government to run their lives for them and be big daddy when all that's really needed in life is some personal responsibility for yourself?
And I suppose we should remove all age regulations on cigarettes, drugs, guns, etc? Because all kids are so honest by nature, full disclosure with their parents... certainly none of them came from broken homes or have no parents, everyone has such a perfect happy little family where no one keeps secrets from each other and the children never do anything wrong.

You're both idiots.

And even if you're both that stupid it doesn't fix the other half of that, no matter how utopian your family situation is that won't keep gambling establishments from cheating you.
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Old 10-10-2016, 02:53 AM   #20
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As long as we're on the same page! I'm not an "It takes a village" moron, thank you. It doesn't take a village. It takes a damn family, with responsible parents.
Yeah and fuck everyone who grows up without responsible parents - heck even those without parents. The government can take care of th... oh wait, the government shouldn't be involved in running peoples lives. Besides, that would only require money. Let those parentless idiots live on the street. And don't take my CSGO skin gambling away!

There is a reason the government gets involved. Usually it is with the best intention but of course sometimes it doesn't work as intended. The system is not perfect - but in sum it is better to have laws and regulations. There is always the option to rally against a law/regulation and turn it around, if you care enough. Usually people are too fat and lazy to care - both figuratively and physically. If you really feel this strongly about CSGO skin gambling and want totally unregulated gambling then stop writing about it on a gaming forum and start lobbying. Heck you might even get Valve in on it, those crooked asshats.
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