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Old 04-15-2019, 02:01 PM   #21
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Probably because the show did go forward without him and so the book may be significantly different. I wouldn't even put it past Martin to change the ending of the book from the show just to spite the TV series.

The entire concept of the books is to do Lord of the Rings only have the bad guys win. An author who is writing a series mostly as a big FU to conventional fantasy novel thinking certainly would consider changing the ending of the book just to have it be different from the show.

I would put good money down that the Night King wins in the books. Something I seriously doubt that the TV producers ever considered.
I'm hoping he doesn't even watch this final season until he's done writing, so it doesn't effect his story. Guess there will be no way to know if that happens though, but it's what I would do.
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Old 04-16-2019, 03:18 AM   #22
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I'm hoping he doesn't even watch this final season until he's done writing, so it doesn't effect his story. Guess there will be no way to know if that happens though, but it's what I would do.
He said that the book ends the same way as the show because he told the show runners how the book ends, that is why I said I think he might change it later just for a laugh. I would.
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Old 04-16-2019, 04:20 AM   #23
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He said that the book ends the same way as the show because he told the show runners how the book ends, that is why I said I think he might change it later just for a laugh. I would.
Wouldn't that kind of mean that the people he has living in the books will be the people that live in the show? So maybe the major good guy characters not dying off anymore isn't really just an HBO thing. IMO, it's that GRRM's shtick just got kind of old. The whole "any character you like could die at any time" doesn't really work when there aren't a ton of characters that people really care about anymore. I'm willing to admit the possibility that I might be a cynic as far as the man's storytelling abilities go though.
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Old 04-16-2019, 04:47 AM   #24
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Wouldn't that kind of mean that the people he has living in the books will be the people that live in the show? So maybe the major good guy characters not dying off anymore isn't really just an HBO thing. IMO, it's that GRRM's shtick just got kind of old. The whole "any character you like could die at any time" doesn't really work when there aren't a ton of characters that people really care about anymore. I'm willing to admit the possibility that I might be a cynic as far as the man's storytelling abilities go though.
Martin should pull a Marvel and build up to an "endgame" over the course of a decade with one set of characters, only to introduce a new character in the final year (book, in his case) who swoops in and saves the day, Mary Sue like.

They should have gotten the same actor to do it for the show too, lol.
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Old 04-16-2019, 07:05 AM   #25
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Wouldn't that kind of mean that the people he has living in the books will be the people that live in the show? So maybe the major good guy characters not dying off anymore isn't really just an HBO thing. IMO, it's that GRRM's shtick just got kind of old. The whole "any character you like could die at any time" doesn't really work when there aren't a ton of characters that people really care about anymore. I'm willing to admit the possibility that I might be a cynic as far as the man's storytelling abilities go though.
Not really. Giving them a general idea where the story is going to go wouldn't keep one individual from dying off, or dying off early or later in the books. It just depends on how important that character is.

You probably wouldn't see Daenerys dying off early in the books because you need her army and her dragons for the big fight with the Night King, but pretty much everyone else would be on the table.

I will still hold to the idea that now that that show is out of the way, he is kinda free to do anything with the novels. In a lot of ways, the last book could be a ton better because he is free to go any weird direction he wants without worrying about what that would do to the show and/or the actors people love.
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Old 04-16-2019, 09:33 AM   #26
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Alternatively, he may feel hamstrung because if he goes off in his own direction and people compare it unfavorably to the show, he'll be remembered as the guy whose own story was finished better by others than by himself.

That would really suck for him, lol.
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Old 04-16-2019, 09:39 AM   #27
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Alternatively, he may feel hamstrung because if he goes off in his own direction and people compare it unfavorably to the show, he'll be remembered as the guy whose own story was finished better by others than by himself.

That would really suck for him, lol.
I'm just getting a laugh out of the idea of him seeing the ending to the show and going, "I'm not doing that!" and then doing some madcap typing at his keyboard just killing off characters left and right.
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Old 04-17-2019, 06:10 AM   #28
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I'm waiting on someone on the show saying that Westeros is engaged in an unsustainable and environmentally destructive way of life and that the Night King is actually an opportunity to lower carbon emissions to a sustainable level.

After all, the dead don't have a high carbon footprint, lol. Especially if they neither eat, engage in commerce, or decay themselves. Carbon capture along with carbon cuts!
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Old 04-17-2019, 07:13 AM   #29
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Not really. Giving them a general idea where the story is going to go wouldn't keep one individual from dying off, or dying off early or later in the books. It just depends on how important that character is.

You probably wouldn't see Daenerys dying off early in the books because you need her army and her dragons for the big fight with the Night King, but pretty much everyone else would be on the table.

I will still hold to the idea that now that that show is out of the way, he is kinda free to do anything with the novels. In a lot of ways, the last book could be a ton better because he is free to go any weird direction he wants without worrying about what that would do to the show and/or the actors people love.
The problem is that he was quickly running out of characters that were actually capable of advancing the plot. I would wager that the number of major character deaths slowed down around the time he would have done so in the books, mainly because the story was finally approaching the actual fight that the series had been building towards.

I'm sure some specific beats are different, but the showrunners were apparently provided with the plan of how Martin envisioned the story concluding at that point in time; he did this partially out of a fear of dying before the story concluded, if memory serves. I would wager that the show is, more or less, progressing how he initially planned the story to go.
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