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Old 02-16-2018, 12:53 PM   #1
Emabulator
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Mueller Indicts 13 Russians, alleging 2016 election interference


LA Times: Special counsel Robert Mueller indicts 13 Russians, alleging 2016 election interference

Quote:
Special counsel Robert S. Mueller III announced charges against 13 Russians and three Russian companies Friday, accusing them of using stolen identities, fake campaign events and hundreds of social media accounts while spending millions of rubles to interfere in the 2016 presidential election in a secret effort to aid the Trump campaign.

The 37-page indictment, the first charges by Mueller's office accusing Moscow of illegal meddling in the election, says the Internet Research Agency, a Russian firm known for using troll accounts to post on news sites, orchestrated the interference campaign and that its operatives tried to communicate with at least three unnamed Trump campaign officials using fake identities.

"By early to mid-2016, Defendants' operation included supporting the presidential campaign of then-candidate Donald J. Trump…and disparaging Hillary Clinton," according to the indictment.

Although the indictment alleges that the Russians contacted unnamed people in the Trump campaign, it does not allege that any high-level Trump campaign officials cooperated with the effort.

"There is no allegation that any American was a willing participant" in the Russian plan, and there is no allegation that it altered the outcome of the election, Deputy Atty. Gen. Rod J. Rosenstein said in a brief news conference discussing the indictment.

Nonetheless, the indictment seriously undermines President Trump's repeated contention that the entire Russia investigation is a "hoax" or "witch hunt." It details specific activities the Russians took, initially focused mostly on creating general discord in the U.S., but eventually focused specifically on boosting Trump's campaign.

White House Press Secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said that Trump had been briefed on the indictment but made no other immediate comment.

The indictment accuses the 13 Russians and three businesses of "impairing, obstructing and defeating the lawful functions of the government through fraud and deceit for the purpose of interfering with the U.S. political and electoral processes, including the presidential election of 2016."

One of those charged was Yevgeniy Prigozhin, a wealthy Russian businessman and caterer who has been publicly identified as a close associate of Russian President Vladimir Putin.

A company controlled by Prigozhin called Concord Management and Consulting funded and directed the interference campaign in the U.S. and other countries, employing the Internet Research Agency, a shadowy internet troll factory that operated from St. Petersburg in Russia, according to the indictment, which refers to the agency as "the organization."

"Concord was the organization's primary source of funding for its interference operations," the indictment reads. "Concord controlled funding, recommended personnel and oversaw organization activities."

In 2014, the organization created a special department focused on using You Tube, Facebook and other social media platforms to influence the U.S. presidential election. The group had a "strategic goal to sow discord in the U.S. political system," according to the indictment, apparently quoting internal Russian documents.

The Russian operations included "supporting the presidential campaign of then-candidate Donald J. Trump" and "disparaging Hillary Clinton," the indictment says.

More than 80 employees were assigned to the project and by 2016, its monthly budget exceeded $1.2 million a month, the charging documents say.

The Russians created fake social media accounts, posing as Americans and in some cases using stolen identities of real Americans, to post messages about divisive issues, such as guns immigrations and on social media accounts.

"The defendants allegedly conducted what they called information warfare against the U.S. with the stated goal of spreading distrust toward the candidates and the political system in general," Rosenstein said. "The indictment alleges that the Russian conspirators want to promote discord in the United States and undermine public confidence in democracy. We must not allow them to succeed."

The attempts to sow division continued after the election, Rosenstein pointed out, as the Russians staged rallies in New York to support and oppose Trump on the same day.

He said U.S. justice officials have not yet communicated with the Russian government about extraditing the accused men to the U.S.
Read on.
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Old 02-16-2018, 01:03 PM   #2
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"There is no allegation that any American was a willing participant" in the Russian plan, and there is no allegation that it altered the outcome of the election, Deputy Atty. Gen. Rod J. Rosenstein said in a brief news conference discussing the indictment.
And anyone with a freaking rational bone in their body has know that since the start. The whole 'collusion' dance has been bullshit all along.
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Old 02-16-2018, 02:56 PM   #3
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And anyone with a freaking rational bone in their body has know that since the start. The whole 'collusion' dance has been bullshit all along.
Of course they know that. This is all a smokescreen to cover the actual collusion of the Obama administration and the state department. Aka Hillary and fusion GPS.
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Old 02-16-2018, 08:37 PM   #4
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A Fake Twitter account?

That's all they could drum up?

Time to press charges against Mueller for running a false investigation!
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Old 02-16-2018, 10:23 PM   #5
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Just an example of how STRONGLY pro-Russian some of the people are involved in the 13 indictments:

https://twitter.com/TheLastRefuge2/s...13076225060864

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This is how badly Mueller needed to *stretch* his affidavit: "unwitting Trump campaign official" That quote is actually describing a single New York volunteer campaign worker who agreed to give some signs to a guy for a his pro-Trump rally.
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Old 02-17-2018, 07:18 AM   #6
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Time to press charges against Mueller for running a false investigation!
Not just him: the Dems (Clinton, Obumbles, DNC) and ideologues in the FBI and DOJ are to blame for this lying, manipulative mess. But at least they're investigating the important things, like phony Trump-Russia collusion, not crazed lunatics in Florida.

I also blame Sessions for a huge chunk of this stupidity. He pulled a big-time cya (cover your ass) by recusing, which opened the door wide open to this entire shit-show. He needn't have recused, but if he felt he had to he should have RESIGNED. There would be no special prosecutor if not for his unnecessary cya recusal. He saved himself and subjected the entire country to this tinfoil conspiracy bullshit.

Edit: When can we expect the Clinton indictment?

Quote:
Special Counsel Robert Mueller indicted foreign citizens for trying to influence the American public about an election because those citizens did not register as a foreign agent nor record their financial expenditures to the Federal Elections Commission. By that theory, when will Mueller indict Christopher Steele, FusionGPS, PerkinsCoie, the DNC and the Clinton Campaign? Mueller’s indictment against 13 Russian trolls claimed their social media political activity was criminal because: they were foreign citizens; they tried to influence an election; and they neither registered under the Foreign Agents Registration Act nor reported their funding to the Federal Elections Commission.
Read it. It's right on the money, and as usual it will NEVER HAPPEN.

Quote:
Don’t expect such an indictment. Mueller chose his targets because he knows they will never appear in court, never contest the charges, and cannot be arrested or extradited as Russian citizens. Mueller’s unprecedented prosecution raises three novel arguments: first, that speaking out about American politics requires a foreign citizen to register under the Foreign Agents Registration Act; second, that speaking out about American politics requires a foreign citizen list their source and expenditure of funding to the Federal Election Commission; and third, that mistakes on visa applications constitute “fraud” on the State Department. All appear to borrow from the now-discredited “honest services” theories Mueller’s team previously used in corporate and bribery cases, cases the Supreme Court overturned for their unconstitutional vagueness. The indictment raises serious issues under the free speech clause of the First Amendment and due process rights under the Fifth Amendment.
These indictments are a face-saving measure to make Mueller's work look defensible; it's a fig leaf to disguise the completely political nature of the entire hit job.
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Old 02-17-2018, 12:11 PM   #7
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A Fake Twitter account?

That's all they could drum up?

Time to press charges against Mueller for running a false investigation!
I really don't to play the whole NO U! card. But in this case, i think this bastard needs to go to prison. He's trying to slow walk it back and save his own credibility at a time when the country is more divided than ever. Screw this guy. This faggot has showed his hand big time.

Also following this logic, i was an American agent working for Marie Le Pen. I shilled hard for her when she was running.

What even is the World Wide Web?
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Old 02-17-2018, 02:48 PM   #8
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Wait a second. If foreign citizens have to be registered as an agent to get any money to participate in commenting about American politics then we need a big sweep through Hollywood and the Music Industy.

I doubt Bono is registered and I have no idea if Madonna still has her US citizenship. Hollywood is a hotbed of Canadians and other foreigners using movies, TV, and Music to comment about American politics and cashing the paycheck from it.

Shouldn’t we be apply the laws equally? Is Muller sure he wants to open this bag of worms? Do these people even think about the ramifications of their actions?

This is a rabbit hole with no end in sight. If you have to be a citizen to comment then everyone is guilty. I’m not about ready to stop bitching about the mess that is the EU or Africa or other shitholes around the world.
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Old 02-18-2018, 05:21 PM   #9
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Wait a second. If foreign citizens have to be registered as an agent to get any money to participate in commenting about American politics then we need a big sweep through Hollywood and the Music Industy.

I doubt Bono is registered and I have no idea if Madonna still has her US citizenship. Hollywood is a hotbed of Canadians and other foreigners using movies, TV, and Music to comment about American politics and cashing the paycheck from it.

Shouldn’t we be apply the laws equally? Is Muller sure he wants to open this bag of worms? Do these people even think about the ramifications of their actions?
Yup, if the laws were intended to be applied equally - which they're not - this would require going after many in Hollywood, the music industry, and whatnot. Also, are foreigners that work for news organizations now required to register as well?

Is there any intent to investigate claims that the Clinton campaign worked with *gasp* foreigners?
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Ukrainian government officials tried to help Hillary Clinton and undermine Trump by publicly questioning his fitness for office. They also disseminated documents implicating a top Trump aide in corruption and suggested they were investigating the matter, only to back away after the election. And they helped Clinton’s allies research damaging information on Trump and his advisers, a Politico investigation found.
No, of course not. And if Hillary had won, it's unlikely it would have been considered an issue that was worth covering like the which is seen today.

Some people, particularly those on the Left, seem to think the idea of foreign influence in U.S. presidential elections is new when it's not. Ironically enough, a Clinton campaign was at the center of this, meaning that it wasn't treated as a serious subversion of democracy in the United States. It is now, since the election didn't go the way that they wanted.

Maybe they've finally found the Russian collusion they're looking for.
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Old 02-19-2018, 03:44 AM   #10
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I've read that the very reason that they're not pressing actual election tampering charges on these Russians is that they would be forced to then make the same charges against many others, including those in the Clinton campaign machine. So they're sticking to more vague charges about wire fraud etc which are brought at the discretion of the special counsel.
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Old 02-19-2018, 03:56 AM   #11
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Good. With yesterdays bad news for Manafort delivered by Gates, this should get the ball rolling on indicting Trump as well.
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Old 02-19-2018, 08:17 AM   #12
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Good. With yesterdays bad news for Manafort delivered by Gates, this should get the ball rolling on indicting Trump as well.
You misspelled "Hillary". Just sayin...
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Old 02-19-2018, 08:27 AM   #13
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Nice to see one of our in-house proggies breathlessly drop a little turd nugget ignoring the 'no there there' in this pile of bullshit.

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You misspelled "Hillary". Just sayin...
lol! True that!

Edit: LOL!

Millions of dollars later, what did we get?

Quote:
...Robert Mueller and his high-priced sham investigators got all the names and the idea for his Russian indictment from a 2015 Radio Free Europe article.

It appears the hotshot liberal Mueller team produced their report with the help of a report written back in 2015.

And there’s this…

The Russian ads mentioned in Mueller’s indictment were already released by the House Intelligence Committee in November 2017.

Facebook previously announced the Russian ads comprised .004% of their advertising during the election.
How to rig an election: "Looking at key states, the total spent on ads targeting Wisconsin was $1,979, according to Senate Intelligence Committee chairman Richard Burr. Ad spending in Michigan was $823. In Pennsylvania, it was $300.

That is not the stuff of rigging elections."

lulz.
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Old 02-20-2018, 08:30 AM   #14
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Well, we can't get him in one day, I know as much. But good people are working on making sure he's properly jailed and they are making good progress with national indictments as well. As mentioned, with the recent change-up for Manafort, it all adds up to bigger things to come in the future. Hopefully within a month, but I can wait, as long as it is a clean bust.
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Old 02-20-2018, 08:46 AM   #15
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I'm sure you'll get him real good.

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Michael Moore, the polemical filmmaker who has long accused President Trump of colluding with Russians, posted videos and pictures of himself participating in a protest in Manhattan that was allegedly organized by Russians in November 2016.

Prosecutors said Friday that the Russians indicted for meddling in the presidential campaign were also behind anti-Trump rallies that occured after the election.
Poor little liberals in mourning, with their puppet masters in Russia pulling their strings.

lulz.
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Old 02-23-2018, 12:31 AM   #16
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Oh nos! More movement from Mueller in the Russian Collusioninvestigation.

Nope, still nothing to do with Trump, just Manafort and Gates still and the activity is unrelated to the outcome of the election. Looks like Gates is going to cooperate in testifying against Manafort in exchange for a 18 month reduced sentence for his part in their money laundering thing in the Ukraine.

So far Mueller has come up with a dozen online trolls and a couple guys Trump had on staff who, once upon a time did nasty business. Good Game Dems.

Hopefully they find some sort of obstruction information soon or they won't be able to keep ignoring the improprieties from the last administration (I'm being nice!).
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Old 02-23-2018, 08:49 AM   #17
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Hopefully they find some sort of obstruction information soon or they won't be able to keep ignoring the improprieties from the last administration (I'm being nice!).
Umm. This is a serious question. Do you care at all about a foreign government messing with our election? I'm not referring to Trump collusion, I have already said that I don't think there is anything of substance there. He's too dumb to collude. But even if he didn't collude, the resounding message that nobody cares which governments or foreign agents tamper with our elections unless they are 3 to 5 million allegedly hispanic illegal voters for Clinton seems absolutely shocking to me.

I have seen more people complain about the investigation than object to the actual election meddling. That seems pretty messed up.
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Old 02-23-2018, 10:09 AM   #18
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Foreign interference in our elections cannot be tolerated. When can we expect the Clinton indictment?

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Special Counsel Robert Mueller indicted foreign citizens for trying to influence the American public about an election because those citizens did not register as a foreign agent nor record their financial expenditures to the Federal Elections Commission. By that theory, when will Mueller indict Christopher Steele, FusionGPS, PerkinsCoie, the DNC and the Clinton Campaign? Mueller’s indictment against 13 Russian trolls claimed their social media political activity was criminal because: they were foreign citizens; they tried to influence an election; and they neither registered under the Foreign Agents Registration Act nor reported their funding to the Federal Elections Commission.
Dem collusion with foreign agents interfering in our elections.

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Don’t expect such an indictment. Mueller chose his targets because he knows they will never appear in court, never contest the charges, and cannot be arrested or extradited as Russian citizens. Mueller’s unprecedented prosecution raises three novel arguments: first, that speaking out about American politics requires a foreign citizen to register under the Foreign Agents Registration Act; second, that speaking out about American politics requires a foreign citizen list their source and expenditure of funding to the Federal Election Commission; and third, that mistakes on visa applications constitute “fraud” on the State Department. All appear to borrow from the now-discredited “honest services” theories Mueller’s team previously used in corporate and bribery cases, cases the Supreme Court overturned for their unconstitutional vagueness. The indictment raises serious issues under the free speech clause of the First Amendment and due process rights under the Fifth Amendment.
Let's have it, folks...indictments of Democrat politicians for colluding with foreigners to impact our election process.
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Old 02-23-2018, 06:25 PM   #19
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Umm. This is a serious question. Do you care at all about a foreign government messing with our election?
Not if there is no evidence of collusion at the State (capital "S")/electoral level. However is it fair to expect such when We (the USA) are guilty of maleficence on the international stage?

Obama admin. sent taxpayer money to campaign to oust Netanyahu

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But even if he didn't collude, the resounding message that nobody cares which governments or foreign agents tamper with our elections unless they are 3 to 5 million allegedly hispanic illegal voters for Clinton seems absolutely shocking to me.
I think you are missing the point that this entire dog and pony show seems to be driven out of a need to find ANYTHING, no matter how thin, to invalidate the Trump presidency. People still can't believe he is legit. While the investigation is still progressing it seems to be a helpless case of throwing good money after bad out of sheer desperation.

Every new Russian troll or charge against someone tangentially related to Trump or his campaign is 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon to Trump and "proof" that the continued investigation is justified.



Quote:
I have seen more people complain about the investigation than object to the actual election meddling. That seems pretty messed up.
That's because it's become such a waste of time. More damage has been done to the credibility of the investigators, the agencies, and the people we're supposed to trust to give us the truth how can we actually believe anything they actually come up with if they do even find something against Trump at this point?

Let's say they do find something that implicates Trump. I'll bet at least half of the people are just as likely to thing it was some sort of planted bomb from the "Secret Society" we know already did plenty of work to sabotage Trump.

In the meantime we have many people from the previous administration, and not just Hillary, with PROVEN crimes, known and other... irregularities having been uncovered since the election facing no repercussions. Not the least of which appears to be a conspiracy between the FBI and DOJ leadership to minimize and cover-up her email negligence and this is just the tip of the iceberg.

The only time we aren't hearing about how the US is now annexed by Russian thanks to their meddling is when we get a reminder how Trump is in the NRAs pocket and personally forcing DACA kids out of the States with his personal M-16 pointed at their head while robbing them to give any cash they have to his rich buddies.

I think the MSM would be worried about low skilled immigration at this point, it doesn't take much to figure out how to copy/paste and Journalism is primarily a left-leaning profession.
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Old 02-24-2018, 07:38 AM   #20
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Umm. This is a serious question. Do you care at all about a foreign government messing with our election? I'm not referring to Trump collusion, I have already said that I don't think there is anything of substance there. He's too dumb to collude. But even if he didn't collude, the resounding message that nobody cares which governments or foreign agents tamper with our elections unless they are 3 to 5 million allegedly hispanic illegal voters for Clinton seems absolutely shocking to me.
No, that's not the resounding message; it's simply what you want to hear your opponents say. This meddling issue appears to be a tool of the Left to hope to hobble or remove the Trump administration rather than address the meddling.

The usual messaging on this topic is some variation of the theme that the Russians meddled and therefore - either through outright claiming it or implication - the Trump administration is illegitimate due to be elected as a result of this meddling/collusion.

Yet - and this is something that has been pointed out before by myself and others - what about the foreign meddling that was the Steele dossier? A person who was a foreigner and filled a dossier with information largely from.... Russians. What about Ukraine's reported efforts to meddle in the campaign? Politico:
Quote:
Ukrainian government officials tried to help Hillary Clinton and undermine Trump by publicly questioning his fitness for office. They also disseminated documents implicating a top Trump aide in corruption and suggested they were investigating the matter, only to back away after the election. And they helped Clinton’s allies research damaging information on Trump and his advisers, a Politico investigation found.
Was that foreign meddling not troublesome? Was the meddling in the last successful Clinton presidential campaign an issue? It wasn't to Democrats at the time.

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I have seen more people complain about the investigation than object to the actual election meddling. That seems pretty messed up.
It's only messed up if you don't or refuse to understand the complaints. Many people complaining about the investigation are doing so because it appears incredibly biased.

The Washington Post has a piece on how things went before with foreign meddling. Yet we're supposed to pretend that a foreign power meddling in U.S. elections is new and that Twitter/Facebook postings, some of which were pro-Leftist causes, decided the election. Oh, and you think illegal voting (that would also be foreign meddling, if they're illegally here) is nothing due to be "statistically insignificant" despite evidence of elections being won by a statistically insignificant amount of votes.
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