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Old 12-18-2017, 04:13 PM   #21
JazGalaxy
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Originally Posted by Chimpbot View Post
There were definitely more than a handful of moments that felt like they belonged in one of the prequels, most especially BB-8 piloting an AT-ST. With that being said, stuff like this...



...is probably hyperbolic bullshit and definitely anecdotal. I saw it twice this weekend and both showings had plenty of laughs from the crowd.

There were a few genuinely funny moments, personally speaking. Some of it made me laugh, the rest made me roll my eyes or sigh a little bit.



I didn't mind Rose; she's far from my favorite, but she's also not as awful as some are saying. The giant cat-horse things on Canto Bight were a bit much and - once again - felt like they'd fit well in one of the prequels.

At it's worst, TLJ isn't any worse than what we've seen over the course of the six Lucas films.
No, Iím not being hyperbolic st all when I say nobody laughed. There was a ton of clapping when the film started, a couple loud ďughĒs Of surprise when Luke threw the lightsaber away, a little pocket of clapping when Luke was revealed to be an astral projection, and then a wisp of clapping when the movie was over that sounded like three or so people. Not joking at all.

I saw it on opening night at 10:30 Thursday, so I might have had the hardest of hard core adults who were in no mood to laugh, but there was no laughter.
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Old 12-18-2017, 04:24 PM   #22
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At it's worst, TLJ isn't any worse than what we've seen over the course of the six Lucas films.
For me, itís not that TLJ does things worse than the prequels, itís that it has none of the saving highlights. Those movies are bad. But at the same time, they gave cinematic moments that I think are classic cinema moments. Pod Racing, Darth Maul, The Zam Wessel chase... these are moments that were instantly iconic, even in bad films. I donít see any of that in TLJ. For me, I canít see a kid leaving the theatre and being like ďI want the toy of that!Ē.

It feels like a movie made for adults who forgot what kids are like. Itís like a mom who throws a kid a birthday party and serves quinois, pita chips and hummice. ď...But I cut them into fun shapes! You kids donít like this hummice? I put lemon in it so itís fun!í

Kids donít want stories about the inadequacies of middle aged men.
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Old 12-18-2017, 04:45 PM   #23
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At it's worst, TLJ isn't any worse than what we've seen over the course of the six Lucas films.
I'm probably the biggest Star Wars fanboy on these forums, you can go back and check that I heavily defended Episode 7 and if you go back further still to my old id from my dial up account- BenSkywalker, I also defended the prequels(still will).

TLJ destroys the Star Wars universe on pretty much every level. People's issues with the prequels were that they weren't as good as the originals(no matter what people say, I still have episode 3 as better then episode 6) and that is an argument I would debate, but could understand- The Last Jedi is different- it breaks the mythos of the entire fictional universe. As a Star Wars movie it is not possible to defend it.

Besides being a steaming pile of shit as a stand alone movie, it also undermines all of the other movies, makes them significantly lesser. The only whiff we got of that with the prequels was midichlorians and Noooooo- neither of which I would be thrilled to defend. TLJ destroys everything that makes Star Wars, Star Wars.

You want to argue it's just a series of movies that's fine. Let Disney enjoy what run of the mill movies do at the box office.

The second Matrix obliterated the original in the opening run.

I am the guy that defended the prequels and Episode 7 on these very forums. This film is just disgusting.
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Old 12-18-2017, 05:51 PM   #24
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I will add that there was no one laughing in my theater either. You could tell people were kinda pissed off when they left.
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Old 12-18-2017, 06:40 PM   #25
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For me, itís not that TLJ does things worse than the prequels, itís that it has none of the saving highlights. Those movies are bad. But at the same time, they gave cinematic moments that I think are classic cinema moments. Pod Racing, Darth Maul, The Zam Wessel chase... these are moments that were instantly iconic, even in bad films. I donít see any of that in TLJ. For me, I canít see a kid leaving the theatre and being like ďI want the toy of that!Ē.

It feels like a movie made for adults who forgot what kids are like. Itís like a mom who throws a kid a birthday party and serves quinois, pita chips and hummice. ď...But I cut them into fun shapes! You kids donít like this hummice? I put lemon in it so itís fun!í

Kids donít want stories about the inadequacies of middle aged men.
This is exactly what I have been telling my friends since TFA.

This new trilogy is so neutered.
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Old 12-18-2017, 08:48 PM   #26
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TLJ destroys everything that makes Star Wars, Star Wars.
Exactly.

It's like a restaraumt in a college town that does killer business by selling. Good food at a cheap price. Eventually the place decides that they need to expand and start trying to broaden the menu to cater to adults and people who live in the town. They broaden the menu, increase the prices, change the atmosphere to attract wealthier people and not just college students and suddenly they realize they have no more customers. By trying to get more, they ruined what they had. They didn't appreciate lightning in a bottle as being a very specific recipe.

A bird in the hand is worth two In the bush.

STAR Wars is mainlining a distilled version of a boys childhood fantasy. By trying to remix it and spin it on it's ear, they have alienated a lot of people who come for a very specific thing.
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Old 12-18-2017, 10:58 PM   #27
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My wife also commented that Star Wars is the male power fantasy taken cinematic form and by attempting to pander to women & minorities they are missing a lot of what draws in the key Male age 18 - 24 demographic in the first place.

Star Wars always had a strong female character, but didn’t try to make that the LEAD character and that was part of the reason it worked. Daisy Ridley just isn’t that great of an actress and doesn’t have the face to pull off any of the serious moments. She always looks like she just popped off the front cover of Teen Vogue even during what should be serious moments for her character. I think that is even worse in Last Jedi than TFA because of a greater emphasis on close-ups.

JJ Abrams is going to have his work cut out for him trying to figure out what to do for the third movie in the trilogy now that Rian Johnson has undone all the progress from The Force Awakens. The idea of giving us essentially the first Star Wars movie all over again in TFA was to put the series back on track and back grounded in that world, now we are back to square one again with the story and it’s like none of the last four movies ever existed. (Episode 4 - 7, I mean, Episode 1 - 3 don’t exist and you can’t tell me otherwise.)

Where do you go now that all the Jedi are dead, all the old cast is dead (some of them literally dead) and the new characters just aren’t that great? I don’t think I care to see any more of fat lesbian Asian girlfriend and Finn went from heroic to just a whiny runaway.

Poe is about the only character who still seems to have promise, though they did their best to tear him down and make it seem like he was just a hotheaded idiot who needed to be told what to do by the “women”.
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Old 12-18-2017, 11:30 PM   #28
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Daisy Ridley just isnít that great of an actress and doesnít have the face to pull off any of the serious moments. She always looks like she just popped off the front cover of Teen Vogue
I think you may be giving her too much credit in the acting and looks department. If they wanted Keira Knightley they should have just hired her and gotten closer to both.
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Old 12-19-2017, 12:19 AM   #29
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I enjoyed it, had some dump moments (canto, hyperspace jumping through the ship), but overall I thought it was a whole lot better than Force Awakens. I didn't mind the length and the pacing was on point for me.

But hopefully Abrams can top both of these though, not keeping my hopes up as I haven't liked that much anything he's done previously. The Han Solo movie will probably be a pass for me though at least in the theaters.
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Old 12-19-2017, 12:47 AM   #30
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The idea of giving us essentially the first Star Wars movie all over again in TFA was to put the series back on track and back grounded in that world, ...
Spot on. I think a LOT of people donít realize this. A lot of people literally think that JJ Abrahamís did it because he ďran out of ideasĒ.

As for Poe, I agree with you that his character is the best right now. But I honestly think his entire storyline was meant to be about ďmansplainingí. The whole story is basically about how he refuses to listen to a woman and goes around doing dumb testosterone fueled stuff until he realizes they were wrong and he was right.

Iíd say Iím just reading into it, but they made sure to double down on that line ďTHATS General Hoda? Doesnít look like I imagined..Ē meaning a woman.
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Old 12-19-2017, 12:51 AM   #31
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I enjoyed it, had some dump moments (canto, hyperspace jumping through the ship),.
If Iím not mistaken, isnít this the second or third Star Wars movie that has had a ďletís hit the ship with our shipĒ moment? I donít mind it happening because I imagine that rebels and terrorists would use this technique all the time. But I dislike the idea that they keep making it seem like itís a big clever concept.
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Old 12-19-2017, 01:48 AM   #32
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I liked it! I did not like hyperspace suicide through the biggest ship in Star Wars history. If it were that easy to take down a warship of that size:
1. Why didn't they do that in the first place?
2. Why would anyone build a ship of that size?

Star Wars had previously always been about the grand super weapons that, to take one down previously, needed its shields nullified from a fleet-wide assault (i.e. Return of the Jedi: Super Star Destroyer, Rogue One: Star Destroyer) or a specific weakness exploited. In this case, a vessel a step above freighter was able to rip a machine the that looked easily twice the mass of Darth Vader's flagship down before a pebble had been thrown at it.
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Old 12-19-2017, 05:17 AM   #33
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I went in with hope, came out gutted. I will forever detest Disney Star Wars.

I reject their canon and insert my own - Legends.
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Old 12-19-2017, 06:21 AM   #34
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I liked it! I did not like hyperspace suicide through the biggest ship in Star Wars history. If it were that easy to take down a warship of that size:
1. Why didn't they do that in the first place?
2. Why would anyone build a ship of that size?
Agreed on both; this was probably the one scene everyone in my showing enjoyed.

But you're so right... if it was this easy people would be strapping hyper-drives on anything that could fit them and use them as super-torpedoes for the massive ships the Empire has a proclivity for. A cruiser firing an A-Wing sized torpedo to gut the first Death Star doesn't sound too far-fetched. It even goes through shields, am I right?

I thought the spectacle was done really well and the visuals were tight, regardless of how it follows "Star Wars logic".
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Old 12-19-2017, 07:17 AM   #35
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I went in with hope, came out gutted. I will forever detest Disney Star Wars.

I reject their canon and insert my own - Legends.
^ This. Fuck you Disney Star Wars.
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Old 12-19-2017, 08:16 AM   #36
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Did anyone else think the nearly all-red 'throne room' was somehow weird and out of place? It just looked so...odd to me. Like some cheap B film set piece/scene from the 50s.
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Old 12-19-2017, 08:55 AM   #37
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Did anyone else think the nearly all-red 'throne room' was somehow weird and out of place? It just looked so...odd to me. Like some cheap B film set piece/scene from the 50s.
Indeed I did. It bothered me greatly but I couldn't succinctly put into words why. Your cheap B film set analogy is spot on perfect. Thank you for scratching that brain itch for me.
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Old 12-19-2017, 09:08 AM   #38
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It's a transformers movie plot with Star Wars imagery. Complete trash
Nailed it. Good God I wanted to like this move, but it was shit. You know you have problems when suddenly kylo ren is your deepest character and the lynch pin of your franchise.
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Old 12-19-2017, 09:57 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Rommel View Post
I liked it! I did not like hyperspace suicide through the biggest ship in Star Wars history. If it were that easy to take down a warship of that size:
1. Why didn't they do that in the first place?
2. Why would anyone build a ship of that size?

Star Wars had previously always been about the grand super weapons that, to take one down previously, needed its shields nullified from a fleet-wide assault (i.e. Return of the Jedi: Super Star Destroyer, Rogue One: Star Destroyer) or a specific weakness exploited. In this case, a vessel a step above freighter was able to rip a machine the that looked easily twice the mass of Darth Vader's flagship down before a pebble had been thrown at it.
Exactly this. Before those last two ships ran out of fuel, they could have turned them around and used them as a torpedo to take down Snoke's Star Destroyer.
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Old 12-19-2017, 11:51 AM   #40
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Exactly this. Before those last two ships ran out of fuel, they could have turned them around and used them as a torpedo to take down Snoke's Star Destroyer.
I choose to believe that they simply failed to realize that Hoda was still on the ship. Perhaps tractor beam technology has something that keeps a ship in place if they had reason to think they may hyperspace out if there.

Itís also incredibly reckless of the suicide attacker. A ship that big could easily do massive damage to a smaller planet on its lightspeed vector beyond its target. Or if it got bumped off itís trajectory.
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