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Old 10-12-2019, 03:45 PM   #4741
vallor
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Turkey is an ally of convenience. President for Life Estrogen is just one step away from making his country Iran. And thanks to being part of NATO we can't even punish Turkey properly when they do something fucked up.

If Turkey were not located where they were, they wouldn't be part of NATO or even considered an ally by the US.

If Turkey were not willing to soak the EU for millions of Euros to hold back the mass of Muslims trying to get into the EU, they would not be considered an ally.

They are an odious regime who gets away with what they want because NATO. Fortunately they haven't become a member of the EU yet, but I am sure they are just a few million possible Muslim refugees short of blackmailing for that.

Is their history with the Kurds complicated? Yes, it sure is. The Kurds have also helped Turkey on occasion.

Does that mean we should indulge and even use Turkey's campaign of Genocide against the Kurds as leverage? "What if we abandoned the Kurds so you could strike the them without consequence? What would that be worth to you?"

It's shitty and to even argue it is OK to leave knowing a genocide will take place shows how charred a soul some people have.
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Old 10-12-2019, 03:57 PM   #4742
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It's shitty and to even argue it is OK to leave knowing a genocide will take place shows how charred a soul some people have.
You reek of naive condescending moralizing. Go to Congress, get either a declaration of war or at least an authorization for American forces to DIE in the interest of stopping NOTHING in a centuries long war between MARXIST and ISLAMIST enemies who will not be dissuaded by the presence of Americans while you create the conditions that cause an actual genocide as moron President Dimwit Bushit did by invading Iraq unnecessarily and moron President Obumbles did in Libya by interfering there as well.

Yes indeed, let's have a shooting war with Turkey over Marxists who don't even have a nation to call home and who don't have any kind of treaty or congressional authorization from us to be there!

Armchair moralizers are the bestest.
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Old 10-12-2019, 04:39 PM   #4743
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and the 1000 or so ISIS troops they have held that WON'T be held anymore once turkey moves and they just restart fucking ISIS.
It isn't 1,000 ISIS troops, it is over 11,000.

Turkey is already threatening to release refugees to flood Europe if they dare push back against the invasion of Serbia.

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Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan threatened European countries that Turkey would "open the gates and send 3.6 million refugees your way" if they labeled Turkey's actions an invasion.
As far as getting out of "endless wars" and "recalling the troops" there are still plenty of US military personnel on the ground in Syria. Just not in the way of Turkey's desire to commit genocide against the Kurds.

Guess the Kurds should have helped the US at Normandy or whatever it is Trump thinks they should have done before he opened them up to Turkey's genocide.
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Old 10-12-2019, 04:47 PM   #4744
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...whatever it is Trump thinks...
Trump, Trump, Trump. You haven't understood a thing in this thread on this topic, lol.




This is clearly beyond your intellectual understanding. Time to send you to the kids table while adults talk. Adios!
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Old 10-13-2019, 09:12 AM   #4745
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Turkey is an ally of convenience. President for Life Estrogen is just one step away from making his country Iran. And thanks to being part of NATO we can't even punish Turkey properly when they do something fucked up.
I believe Turkey is actually the opposite, they're an ally of inconvenience. Being part of NATO does not prevent the U.S. from imposing sanctions on them. What protects Turkey is it's position, both geographically and militarily, versus Russia. The U.S. and much of NATO value that position more than potentially further diminishing or completely losing it over punishing Turkey for something it's been doing regularly, year after year now.

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If Turkey were not located where they were, they wouldn't be part of NATO or even considered an ally by the US.
If they weren't located where they were and didn't have the military they have, sure -- but they do and are located there. We're allies with countries for a reason, not simply because it'd be fun.

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If Turkey were not willing to soak the EU for millions of Euros to hold back the mass of Muslims trying to get into the EU, they would not be considered an ally.
Turkey is currently dealing with nearly 3.7 million refugees, mostly believed to be from the Syrian conflict. This means that Turkey is likely taking in more refugees than all of Europe.

Dealing with that will have a high cost, both monetarily and socially. The deal Turkey and the EU struck was for the EU to be able to send back an illegal immigrants coming from Turkey back to Turkey, for about $3.3 billion. Turkey claims to have spent around $40 billion to house and care for those in the refugee camps and whatnot in Turkey. Essentially the EU is paying Turkey to take care of this refugee issue, it's not simply Turkey soaking or trying to soak the EU. I'm suspicious of the $40 billion figure, but it's likely higher than what he's getting from the EU.

Turkey can't flood the EU with immigrants, despite what Erdogan is threatening. What Turkey can do is not prevent the immigrants from heading towards Europe. That is a very important distinction, since it essentially means that Turkey is to be a buffer for Europe, policing the border on their behalf and not Turkey's. What Turkey can do is what they're doing now: push the Kurds back, who they consider a threat, and utilize a portion of Syria that the Syrians can't control to setup these camps. This allows Turkey to create a buffer from groups and affiliates that are designated by the U.S. as terrorist groups and reduce the social and economic strain on their country.

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They are an odious regime who gets away with what they want because NATO. Fortunately they haven't become a member of the EU yet, but I am sure they are just a few million possible Muslim refugees short of blackmailing for that.
Sure, Turkey is run by some terrible people and their position that lead to them being a part of NATO has helped, but the EU Is also using them as the main buffer for people coming out of Syria. They may close in on having 4 million predominately Muslim refugees this year, I thought the Leftist EU loved that?

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Is their history with the Kurds complicated? Yes, it sure is. The Kurds have also helped Turkey on occasion.
I don't think it's particularly complicated, however the media is now in full-steam "the Kurds are all one and the same, never mind the Kurdish groups that are designated as terrorist organizations" because that's how they want to spin this tale.

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Does that mean we should indulge and even use Turkey's campaign of Genocide against the Kurds as leverage? "What if we abandoned the Kurds so you could strike the them without consequence? What would that be worth to you?"
Is what Turkey is doing is genocide? Are the Kurds being targeted because they're simply Kurdish or because they're in a specific area and represent a real or perceived threat to Turkey? Is it a combination?

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It's shitty and to even argue it is OK to leave knowing a genocide will take place shows how charred a soul some people have.
Why are you certain that Turkey is committing genocide here? Turkey is doing exactly what they said they would when the previous administration urged them to take military action -- they're creating a buffer between them and what's considered Kurdistan. Unless Turkey is purposely targeting groups simply for being Kurdish and not under a belief that they're part of the military elements which have long had violent clashes with them, then it's simply not genocide. Considering nearly 20% of Turkey is believed to be Kurdish, it doesn't seem that Turkish military strikes into Syria on what are believed to be Kurdish fighters to create a buffer zone is anything close to genocide.

Was it genocide when Turkey was carrying out these military operations over the last 6 years or so? These operations aren't new, and having U.S. troops in the area did not stop them. The argument that we could just leave the troops there to shield the Kurds stands in stark contrast to what we know has occurred while U.S. troops remained deployed to Syria.
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Old 10-13-2019, 07:54 PM   #4746
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Turkey is currently dealing with nearly 3.7 million refugees, mostly believed to be from the Syrian conflict. This means that Turkey is likely taking in more refugees than all of Europe.
Which is leverage against the rest of the world, but particularly the EU leaders who rarely met a refugee they didn't want to bend over backwards to feed, cloth, give money to, and all the other good stuff.

Fortunately Turkey makes it so they don't have to meet said refugee.

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Dealing with that will have a high cost, both monetarily and socially.
A Muslim country dealing with 99.9% Muslim refugees seems ideal to me, especially with President for Life Andrognyn trying to build his own Caliphate and bring back the glory of the Ottoman Empire.

I suspect Turkey is getting more out of it than people think. I think they're using this show of partnership and "benevolence" to gain entry into the EU. And it will probably work.

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I don't think it's particularly complicated, however the media is now in full-steam "the Kurds are all one and the same, never mind the Kurdish groups that are designated as terrorist organizations" because that's how they want to spin this tale.
Kurds as a whole in Turkey are barely second class citizens and are hardly tolerated. Obviously a government who treats civilians poorly due to the group they belong to is going to feel much more strongly against any Kurdish group who dares arm themselves and push back against Turkey. That instantly makes them Terrorists as far as Turkey is concerned.

There has been a persistent campaign of attempted genocide, both cultural and as a people, since Turkey was formed and especially after the 1980 coup.

Suppression of Kurdish people and customs, usually at the point of the gun, has been a way of life in Turkey for almost a century and they have the 50,000 deaths at the hands of the government during that time to show how badly they are treated.

The very identity of the Kurdish people is suppressed in Turkey. They are relegated to ghettos and for a good amount of time they weren't even allowed to speak or sing in their own language without being arrested and/or imprisoned.

Just because it has been happening and the Turks never really stopped killing doesn't mean it isn't genocide and they should be allowed to continue.

That said, I can see why a country would want to excise what they see as terrorists from their midst. After all, we have plenty of incompatible Americans within our borders which we'd probably be better off getting rid of.

However, decency and a desire NOT to fall into deliberate humanitarian atrocities stops the US. This is not the case with Turkey.

Quote:
Is what Turkey is doing is genocide? Are the Kurds being targeted because they're simply Kurdish or because they're in a specific area and represent a real or perceived threat to Turkey? Is it a combination?

<SNIP>

Was it genocide when Turkey was carrying out these military operations over the last 6 years or so?
YES! When Turkey targets a specific people for annihilation it is genocide. It doesn't matter how long they've been doing it or even why. Genocide is genocide.

Turkey has been waging a war of genocide against the Kurds in and out of their borders for a century.

Let me be clear, for the retards here, like Terran, I don't think we should spend a the time or life of a single American Military asset to prevent the Kurds and Turks from doing what apparently comes naturally to them.

I don't think the Kurds should be given their own homeland manufactured in the same way Israel was.

What I do think is that Estrogen has clearly proven he has no self-control since the moment he got the green light he started bombing the Kurdish positions which, to date, had not been the source of a single aggressive attack against Turkey.

That means it's time to twist the nipples of Turkey and, at least, impose the same sanctions which impacted their economy last time till Androgen stops attacking people who have been helpful, if maybe "odious" allies (in Turkey's opinion) to the West during the ISIS fights.

Fights which may yet come back to haunt us since this withdrawal was handled with less finesse than the withdrawal which initially kicked off ISIS in the beginning.
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Old 10-14-2019, 05:21 PM   #4747
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Which is leverage against the rest of the world, but particularly the EU leaders who rarely met a refugee they didn't want to bend over backwards to feed, cloth, give money to, and all the other good stuff.

Fortunately Turkey makes it so they don't have to meet said refugee.
If EU leaders rarely meet a refugee that they don't want to bend over backwards to provide for, then it should be no threat at all for Turkey to say they're not going to absorb them and will instead allow any who want to go towards the EU to attempt it. Turkey is roughly the same population as Germany. Germany is #4 in the world as far as GDP versus Turkey being #20.

Now since the EU leaders likely understand the strain of absorbing so many refugees causes a variety of issues, the EU is leveraging Turkey's desire to join it by demanding that they take on such a huge portion of the refugee and illegal immigration issue.

Who actually has the leverage here, Turkey or the EU on this issue? It seems that Turkey is expected to bear the blunt of this flow in favor of the EU's position.


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A Muslim country dealing with 99.9% Muslim refugees seems ideal to me, especially with President for Life Andrognyn trying to build his own Caliphate and bring back the glory of the Ottoman Empire.

I suspect Turkey is getting more out of it than people think. I think they're using this show of partnership and "benevolence" to gain entry into the EU. And it will probably work.
Why does it seem ideal to feed millions of people to Erdogan when you believe he is attempting to build his own so-called caliphate? Accepting these refugees isn't an act meant to make Turkey appear as benevolent, it was a demand of the EU itself. It's unclear if Turkey, which has been pursuing membership into the EU its inception, will finally gain membership into the EU -- but if the UK does exit, they're more likely to. Still, the EU is leveraging its position to make Turkey adhere to their demands and not the other way around.



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Kurds as a whole in Turkey are barely second class citizens and are hardly tolerated. Obviously a government who treats civilians poorly due to the group they belong to is going to feel much more strongly against any Kurdish group who dares arm themselves and push back against Turkey. That instantly makes them Terrorists as far as Turkey is concerned.
Sure, yet the terrorist groups I'm citing are those declared by the United States to be terrorist groups. Articles about the U.S. in Syria used to note the links to the PKK and other terrorist groups, but that's no longer convenient.

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There has been a persistent campaign of attempted genocide, both cultural and as a people, since Turkey was formed and especially after the 1980 coup.

Suppression of Kurdish people and customs, usually at the point of the gun, has been a way of life in Turkey for almost a century and they have the 50,000 deaths at the hands of the government during that time to show how badly they are treated.
The Kurds are treated poorly and suppressed. However, the 50,000 deaths at the hands of the government isn't simply pulling people out of their homes and executing them for being Kurdish. There was/is a war between Kurdish factions and Turkey, with those Kurdish terrorist factions being no strangers to carrying out what are commonly viewed as terrorist attacks within Turkey.

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The very identity of the Kurdish people is suppressed in Turkey. They are relegated to ghettos and for a good amount of time they weren't even allowed to speak or sing in their own language without being arrested and/or imprisoned.
Yes, that's true. Turkey's poor treatment of the Kurds does not absolve certain Kurdish groups of their terrorist attacks.

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Just because it has been happening and the Turks never really stopped killing doesn't mean it isn't genocide and they should be allowed to continue.
I simply don't agree that it's genocide. I believe Turkey has poorly treated the Kurds, along with Iraq, Syria, and other nations as well.

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That said, I can see why a country would want to excise what they see as terrorists from their midst. After all, we have plenty of incompatible Americans within our borders which we'd probably be better off getting rid of.

However, decency and a desire NOT to fall into deliberate humanitarian atrocities stops the US. This is not the case with Turkey.
Militant groups among the Kurds have objectively and measurably been seen to be willing to carryout attacks on Turkey. This isn't simply a case of not liking Kurds for being Kurdish by Turkey, as there is actual wrongdoing by Kurdish terrorist groups.


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YES! When Turkey targets a specific people for annihilation it is genocide. It doesn't matter how long they've been doing it or even why. Genocide is genocide.

Turkey has been waging a war of genocide against the Kurds in and out of their borders for a century.
Turkey is certainly capable of real cruelty and genocide, however these strikes against the Kurds are absolutely not an act of genocide. If they start just mowing down Kurds for being Kurds and no other reason, then sure -- they're not currently doing that. What they're doing is the same as they've been doing for the last several years, carrying out operations in order to expand a buffer zone.

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Let me be clear, for the retards here, like Terran, I don't think we should spend a the time or life of a single American Military asset to prevent the Kurds and Turks from doing what apparently comes naturally to them.

I don't think the Kurds should be given their own homeland manufactured in the same way Israel was.

What I do think is that Estrogen has clearly proven he has no self-control since the moment he got the green light he started bombing the Kurdish positions which, to date, had not been the source of a single aggressive attack against Turkey.

That means it's time to twist the nipples of Turkey and, at least, impose the same sanctions which impacted their economy last time till Androgen stops attacking people who have been helpful, if maybe "odious" allies (in Turkey's opinion) to the West during the ISIS fights.

Fights which may yet come back to haunt us since this withdrawal was handled with less finesse than the withdrawal which initially kicked off ISIS in the beginning.
The withdrawal from Iraq and Syria are completely different situations. Reports claim that there remain pockets of ISIS.

We can sanction Turkey, sure, but what's the downside? ISIS is terrible. The victims caught in the crossfire of ISIS, the Kurds, Turkey, Syria, Russia, the U.S., and others is awful. Everything has a cost, what is the cost of sanctioning Turkey going to be?

Ergoden doesn't appear to have no self-control. In fact, he seems to have tempered his incursions into Syria despite publicly announcing what he intended to do for years. He knows what's at play there. The region is important, and he's trying to get everything from Russia, the EU, and the United States that he can. He gambled with the S-400, which may turn out to be a win for him. The importance of Turkey's position has risen after more people came to understand the while the Cold War may be considered over, Russia and the West are still very much at odds.

If the United States pulls its nukes out of Turkey, then we'll likely seem some real harmful sanctioning of them.

I agree that historically the Kurds have gotten a shitty deal. I agree that the leader of Turkey is a bad dude, and Kurds are treated poorly in Turkey (and beyond). However, there are far bigger issues for the U.S. to handle there and the Kurds are unfortunately intertwined with terrorist groups where Turkey intends to make a buffer zone. I believe Turkey has a legitimate reason to want to make this buffer zone. I believe they also will twist it in an attempt to keep the Kurds under their thumb. Unfortunately the Kurds gave these rationale behind the military strikes real legs to stand on.
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Old 10-14-2019, 05:32 PM   #4748
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Let me be clear, for the retards here, like Terran, I don't think we should spend a the time or life of a single American Military asset to prevent the Kurds and Turks from doing what apparently comes naturally to them.

I don't think the Kurds should be given their own homeland manufactured in the same way Israel was.
So you agree with my position. Nice to see you awaken to reality.

Dumbass.

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What I do think is that Estrogen has clearly proven he has no self-control since the moment he got the green light he started bombing the Kurdish positions which, to date, had not been the source of a single aggressive attack against Turkey.

The moment he got the green light? He's been doing that for years. Have a word with Obumbles.

Moron.
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Old 10-14-2019, 05:51 PM   #4749
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Let me guess Venom, you didn't believe the Armenians were genocided either.
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Old 10-14-2019, 06:17 PM   #4750
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Let me guess Venom, you didn't believe the Armenians were genocided either.
I believe the Armenians were the victims of the Armenian Holocaust because all of the evidence supports that, just like the Holocaust against the Jews and other groups in WW2. In fact, the post of mine before this eludes to that:
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Turkey is certainly capable of real cruelty and genocide, however these strikes against the Kurds are absolutely not an act of genocide.
So, you believe in the Armenian Holocaust but not the Jews being victims of genocide in WW2 during the Holocaust? That's quite interesting, but it seems to have a boring underlying reason: your anti-semitism.
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Old 10-14-2019, 07:13 PM   #4751
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I read an article asking if we owe the Kurds a war. It didn't do anything to change my opinion on how awful Turkey's human rights record is toward the Kurds and it boggles the mind how people here can blithly sign off on letting people get persecuted.

"Turkey has been doing this for years" and "Turkey is just creating a buffer zone" are just excuses to look the other way while Turkey is finally given free reign to institute a final deathblow to the Kurds.

And neither Europe nor the US are willing to do the DIPLOMATIC things (not military) to put enough pressure on Turkey that when they say "knock it off" it has teeth.

However, something I read from a Vietnamese soldier struck me as capital-T "Truth".

This is slightly modified, but the meat is here.

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I wished that the US just provided us weapon[s], intelligence, training and let us fight ourselves and either win or loose it will be our decision instead of dragging the war for over 10 years and many lives loss, we ended up running away in shame. American don't speak our language, don't understand our culture, how can they win? Same as in the Middle East.

Best is to provide weapons and intelligence and let the people fight for their own fate.
So the answer IMO is "No" we don't owe the Kurds a war.

However, we should continue to arm them and give them as much material support as makes sense. Considering how many of our guns and vehicles made it into the hands of ISIS we should definitely keep an eye out to make sure those items we provide are being used by the Kurdish factions we actually give them to.

We should also sanction the shit out of Turkey because we already know they are attacking positions and people which are no threat to them. Most of the forces they're attacking have already removed themselves from the border area but Turkey is shelling and airstriking remote positions anyway.

When Iran, Assad, and Russia all want Turkey to do the same thing I have to wonder in who's benefit it is. General Mattis, one of the greatest warriors alive, resigned due to the fucknuttery of leaving the Kurds to Turkey and allowing Turkey, Iran, Syria, and Russia to grow their influence in the region.

All hail the Ottoman Empire!
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Old 10-14-2019, 07:36 PM   #4752
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I read an article asking if we owe the Kurds a war. It didn't do anything to change my opinion on how awful Turkey's human rights record is toward the Kurds and it boggles the mind how people here can blithly sign off on letting people get persecuted.
I don't think you're characterizing opposition to your stance correctly. Claims that Kurdish militias carried out the torture, murder, and targeting of their political rivals (i.e., not ISIS or Turkey) are out there. We armed and trained a group that is consistently in armed conflict with Turkey. Some claim that the Kurdish groups that we work with in Syria are truly just the PKK under a different name, in an effort to get around limitations of the United States government as far as arming and training goes. You don't seem to put much weight into the connection between U.S. designated terrorist groups and the Kurdish forces being targeted.

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"Turkey has been doing this for years" and "Turkey is just creating a buffer zone" are just excuses to look the other way while Turkey is finally given free reign to institute a final deathblow to the Kurds.
This won't be a final deathblow to the Kurds. In fact, the perceived buffer zone doesn't even cover all Kurdish controlled territory.

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So the answer IMO is "No" we don't owe the Kurds a war.

However, we should continue to arm them and give them as much material support as makes sense. Considering how many of our guns and vehicles made it into the hands of ISIS we should definitely keep an eye out to make sure those items we provide are being used by the Kurdish factions we actually give them to.
We have been arming and training Kurdish factions, including ones linked to groups recognized as terrorist groups. Once you provide the weapons, they go where they go. They could attempt to do a tow-like policy, but that's incredibly limiting to the very people you wish to arm.


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We should also sanction the shit out of Turkey because we already know they are attacking positions and people which are no threat to them. Most of the forces they're attacking have already removed themselves from the border area but Turkey is shelling and airstriking remote positions anyway.
Maybe, but we'd have to remove our nuclear weapons and forces from Turkey most likely prior to this. That would be what Iran, Syria, and Russia want. Does that make it automatically wrong? Not necessarily.

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When Iran, Assad, and Russia all want Turkey to do the same thing I have to wonder in who's benefit it is. General Mattis, one of the greatest warriors alive, resigned due to the fucknuttery of leaving the Kurds to Turkey and allowing Turkey, Iran, Syria, and Russia to grow their influence in the region.
That's not why Mattis resigned.
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Old 10-14-2019, 07:42 PM   #4753
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... it boggles the mind how people here can blithly sign off on letting people get persecuted...

...So the answer IMO is "No" we don't owe the Kurds a war.

However, we should continue to arm them and give them as much material support as makes sense
Bipolar much?

You're arguing with yourself. We've already armed the Kurds to the teeth and we aren't fighting their war for them.

You sound like a lunatic TDS sufferer.

And STFU about genocide already. You've missed the boat on that one. The REAL genocides of the past few decades have been:

* 2003 - Darfur, Sudan. Hundreds of thousands dead. Where were you bitching about our lack of military involvement?
* 2010 - Haiti. The UN kindly spread cholera, an UNKNOWN DISEASE in Haiti, from its helpful post-earthquake troop presence, then denied they did so for as long as possible while nearly a million were infected and 10,000 or so died. Where you you bitching about our lack of involvement?
* Past several decades - North Korea. Millions dead from starvation caused by a lunatic dictatorial regime. Where were you bitching about our lack of military engagement there?

You toss around "genocide" like a retarded fool. The nearest things to a genocide in the Middle East are both related to our INVOLVEMENT, not lack of involvement.

* 2003 invasion of Iraq to withdrawal. Up to a million dead. FOR WHAT? NOTHING.
* 2011-to present, Syria. Caused by our destabilization of Iraq, creating ISIS, creating civil war next door in Syria, killing 500,000 Syrians and displacing millions. FOR WHAT? NOTHING.
* 2011 -to present, Libya. Caused by our destabilizing their nation (intervening), killing tens of thousands. FOR WHAT? NOTHING.

Moron.
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Old 10-14-2019, 09:15 PM   #4754
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Back to liberals destroying things other than entire nations:



NBA Players: We're pissed you cost us money, NBA! All hail China!
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Old 10-14-2019, 10:43 PM   #4755
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I believe the Armenians were the victims of the Armenian Holocaust because all of the evidence supports that, just like the Holocaust against the Jews and other groups in WW2. In fact, the post of mine before this eludes to that:


So, you believe in the Armenian Holocaust but not the Jews being victims of genocide in WW2 during the Holocaust? That's quite interesting, but it seems to have a boring underlying reason: your anti-semitism.
The Jews don't believe Armenians ever faced genocide, see that would take away from their victimhood status doncha know.
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Old 10-15-2019, 03:35 AM   #4756
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The Jews don't believe Armenians ever faced genocide, see that would take away from their victimhood status doncha know.
I think you're confused. "The Jews," which you probably mean the Israeli government, doesn't officially recognize the Armenian Genocide -- just like the how United States government hasn't officially recognized the Armenian Genocide.

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resident Barack Obama will not use the term “genocide” in his address on Friday for strategic reasons and will instead urge reconciliation, a White House official said on Tuesday, despite his promises in 2008 to do so. George W. Bush did the same during his two terms as president, promising to do so, but holding back to maintain a good relationship with a key NATO ally.
Could "The Jews" also be thinking of geopolitical politics? Some say yes:
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Both Armenians and Jews have been the victims of premeditated mass murder. The Israeli government must put justice before political expediency and call the crime by its name.
You may find that quote above hard to stomach since it's also referencing the Holocaust in which the Jews were victims.

Now what I do know is that you're still a Holocaust denier, which is awfully ironic considering your stance here -- especially when it's piled atop of your apparent belief that "the Jews" are Armenian Genocide deniers when a quick search online could have shown you that was incorrect.
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Old 10-15-2019, 05:39 AM   #4757
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That was either some top quality shit, BorisCal, or you suffered a stroke. I'd LOVE to toss a beer or two back with you to figure out which it was, lol.
Sadly, we have an ocean of distance between us, and I'm more of a wine person but if that chance came to pass, I would gladly buy you a couple of beers.
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Old 10-15-2019, 01:53 PM   #4758
SpectralThundr
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I think you're confused. "The Jews," which you probably mean the Israeli government, doesn't officially recognize the Armenian Genocide -- just like the how United States government hasn't officially recognized the Armenian Genocide.



Could "The Jews" also be thinking of geopolitical politics? Some say yes:

You may find that quote above hard to stomach since it's also referencing the Holocaust in which the Jews were victims.

Now what I do know is that you're still a Holocaust denier, which is awfully ironic considering your stance here -- especially when it's piled atop of your apparent belief that "the Jews" are Armenian Genocide deniers when a quick search online could have shown you that was incorrect.
Sure because I'm not stupid enough to believe a guy who couldn't afford to feed his troops, would go through the trouble of having hospital and maternity wards in a death camp designed to gas all the likes.
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Old 10-15-2019, 02:31 PM   #4759
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Sure because I'm not stupid enough to believe a guy who couldn't afford to feed his troops, would go through the trouble of having hospital and maternity wards in a death camp designed to gas all the likes.
Surely you understand the issue with your reasoning here, right? Maybe I can slap it on a fake Patton quote and you'll understand.
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Old 10-15-2019, 02:49 PM   #4760
SpectralThundr
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Surely you understand the issue with your reasoning here, right? Maybe I can slap it on a fake Patton quote and you'll understand.
I'd settle for some proof first. 50+ years and there is still zero proof that 6 gorillion Jews were gased.
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